CHF Negativity - honest question

[KansasTiger 3,284]

Just now, abw0004 said:

I remember the mod doing that, and it wasn’t right.  You don’t deserve that, nobody does.

There was a reason why people had to be removed from the Nest, and some of those are completely banned from the forum now.  There was indeed name calling and demeaning.

What I am trying to point out is mocking people that are on the Nest, or the Nest itself only proves my point.  That’s all.  I’m not saying you are a bad person, so please don’t take it that way.

Then this is a fundamental misunderstanding. Pointing out what the nest had turned into, which was in some regard, a place where certain people with opinions contrary to the views of the majority were not welcome, is not mocking. Those people didn't want to hear our negative takes on the situation. Heck even Red cited that as one of the reasons we were ushered out. 

Maybe the nest has taken a different direction since then. I'll admit some posters that were banned were more aggressive with their opinions than others. But I never saw a single post that justified someone like @DAG for getting ushered out, except his opinion didn't align with the desired...environment.

[Gowebb11 10,081]

37 minutes ago, FelixWDE said:

You're focusing on the negative and saying Hugh hasn't adapted, etc. I'm focusing on the solution; get a new OC.

I like to think I’m focusing on the facts. We had a different OC last year. Hugh blamed him with last year’s performance and essentially fired him. That made him the OC. And we’ve regressed.  So you want Hugh to announce that he was wrong in taking over playcalling and hire another OC? Nexasie that would be 3 in 3 seasons. No chance he does that. He needs to reset his team during this off week, coach better, and win some games. And he’s going to have to do so with his current roster. 

[abw0004 10,420]

Just now, KansasTiger said:

Then this is a fundamental misunderstanding. Pointing out what the nest had turned into, which was in some regard, a place where certain people with opinions contrary to the views of the majority were not welcome, is not mocking. Those people didn't want to hear our negative takes on the situation. Heck even Red cited that as one of the reasons we were ushered out. 

Maybe the nest has taken a different direction since then. I'll admit some posters that were banned were more aggressive with their opinions than others. But I never saw a single post that justified someone like @DAG for getting ushered out, except his opinion didn't align with the desired...environment.

Maybe there is a misunderstanding on my end from what I was told then.  And for the record, I don’t group you, DAG, or cbo in the same group as those that since been banned completely.

I don’t have an issue with what you all say for the most part.  Honestly now, if I disagree, I just move on with my day.  I don’t have time to go back and forth anymore. 

[Old fan 47 825]

3 hours ago, sevenlee36 said:

Hugh Freeze’s RPO has been a turnover machine nearly every year. He only knows RPO and doesn’t know how to adapt an offense to his players. He’s effectively a system where every QB he’s had has produced plenty turnovers. I believe Elitor posted a video on this. May not be a QB issue may be a coach/system issue.

Kind of like GM without Nick and Cam. 

[Hank2020 3,429]

3 hours ago, sevenlee36 said:

Yes I do know that. Thank goodness we didn’t!Doesnt mean he’s coaching to maximize players abilities.

If you coach to maximize players abilities, does that mean Freezes system loses the propensity for producing TO’s? The two don’t seem to be connected at all.

[metafour 5,094]

15 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

I did specifically answer the question.  If he brings in his talent, and we can't win, then perhaps he will have to go, just like Jimbo. But I think Freeze is much more honest and transparent with his players than Jimbo. The players are playing hard for Auburn and their coaches.   New Mexico State didn't have more talent than us, but they clearly had a much better quarterback.  You can't judge the direction of a program by individual wins and losses. Sark's first 2 years at Texas were very subpar, and he took a ton of heat for them. But he was bringing in talent, and that's what ultimately matters the most.  Jimbo is an outlier bringing in talent and not winning with it.  Do you really think we will be in a better place in two years if we bring a new coach in now?  

Sark won 8 games in his second season, which was 3 more wins than year one. In year three he won 12 games.

That is called upward trajectory - it shows that the "plan" is working. This is a terrible example you are trying to use, considering that we are on pace to win FEWER games in year two than we did in year one. That is called regression. You are lying through your teeth if you think that the reasonable pre-season expectation going into this season was that we would win fewer than 6 games (last year's total). The expectation was 7-8 wins - we will come nowhere near that. THIS IS COACHING FAILURE.

The plan can not simply be: "herp derp recruit talent and wins will come". That is at most half of the equation. The other half of the equation is making sure that talent is developing and performing up to expectation, and furthermore actual on-field game planning and decision making. Freeze has failed miserably at everything that isn't HS recruiting. And for the hundredth time: HS recruits will stop coming if he doesn't start winning actual football games. This is not a sustainable model.

[sevenlee36 1,846]

1 minute ago, Hank2020 said:

If you coach to maximize players abilities, does that mean Freezes system loses the propensity for producing TO’s? The two don’t seem to be connected at all.

I don’t think Hugh can coach anything but his system. So as long as ya have him, you’re going to be on the high turnover side. I don’t care about Hugh or any other HC, just Auburn and winning.

[cbo 8,988]

18 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

I’m not quite sure you do understand then.   There is a difference between people being critical and those being toxic.

There are plenty of people being critical of Hugh on the Nest as we speak.  It’s just how you say it and treat others that is the key.

The truth is Freeze was a controversial and divisive hire. There’s a reason Auburn hired a PR firm to manage his onboarding. 

This naturally leads to fans that are overly critical of Freeze and fans that are overly sensitive to any criticism. That’s a downside to hiring Freeze that should be expected.

The trade off needs to be that you win some football games. Instead, we are at historical lows. 
 

[Cardin Drake 2,085]

16 minutes ago, e808 said:

I don’t think you want to use Sark . Look at his trajectory and look at CHF . He is 25-14. CHF is on pace to surpass the 14 losses this year

I specifically do want to use Sark.  Texas was not nearly as talent depleted when he got to Austin as Auburn was when Freeze arrived. He went 5-7 his first year and 8-5 in his 2nd year IN THE BIG 12.   If he wasn't recruiting well, his seat would have been very hot. Lost a lot of games he shouldn't have. Got blown out by Arkansas @ Arkansas.  Texas is interesting. I think they are a very good team, but probably not as good as everyone thinks they are.  The Michigan win doesn't look nearly as good as people thought a few weeks ago.  OU and Georgia will tell a lot in the next two weeks. 

[abw0004 10,420]

2 minutes ago, cbo said:

The truth is Freeze was a controversial and divisive hire. There’s a reason Auburn hired a PR firm to manage his onboarding. 

This naturally leads to fans that are overly critical of Freeze and fans that are overly sensitive to any criticism. That’s a downside to hiring Freeze that should be expected.

The trade off needs to be that you win some football games. Instead, we are at historical lows. 
 

I agree with that.  It’s just a weird time to be an Auburn fan and at a crossroads.  At worst, I see Freeze as our version of Muschamp in his second stint with us as DC  He recruited well and set up Steele to take it and run.  I want Freeze to be successful though so we don’t need another coach until he retires.  Hope is eternal…

[Cardin Drake 2,085]

8 minutes ago, metafour said:

Sark won 8 games in his second season, which was 3 more wins than year one. In year three he won 12 games.

That is called upward trajectory - it shows that the "plan" is working. This is a terrible example you are trying to use, considering that we are on pace to win FEWER games in year two than we did in year one. That is called regression. You are lying through your teeth if you think that the reasonable pre-season expectation going into this season was that we would win fewer than 6 games (last year's total). The expectation was 7-8 wins - we will come nowhere near that. THIS IS COACHING FAILURE.

The plan can not simply be: "herp derp recruit talent and wins will come". That is at most half of the equation. The other half of the equation is making sure that talent is developing and performing up to expectation, and furthermore actual on-field game planning and decision making. Freeze has failed miserably at everything that isn't HS recruiting. And for the hundredth time: HS recruits will stop coming if he doesn't start winning actual football games. This is not a sustainable model.

You didn't answer the question. Do you think we will be better off in two years if we replace Freeze now?  Are you actually arguing for that? 

[FelixWDE 5]

14 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

I like to think I’m focusing on the facts. We had a different OC last year. Hugh blamed him with last year’s performance and essentially fired him. That made him the OC. And we’ve regressed.  So you want Hugh to announce that he was wrong in taking over playcalling and hire another OC? Nexasie that would be 3 in 3 seasons. No chance he does that. He needs to reset his team during this off week, coach better, and win some games. And he’s going to have to do so with his current roster. 

We've lost more games. The offense is a lot better in many ways than last year, and younger.

Stop throwing the baby out with the bath water.

[DAG 35,374]

38 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

Then this is a fundamental misunderstanding. Pointing out what the nest had turned into, which was in some regard, a place where certain people with opinions contrary to the views of the majority were not welcome, is not mocking. Those people didn't want to hear our negative takes on the situation. Heck even Red cited that as one of the reasons we were ushered out. 

Maybe the nest has taken a different direction since then. I'll admit some posters that were banned were more aggressive with their opinions than others. But I never saw a single post that justified someone like @DAG for getting ushered out, except his opinion didn't align with the desired...environment.

[e808 3,307]

31 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

I specifically do want to use Sark.  Texas was not nearly as talent depleted when he got to Austin as Auburn was when Freeze arrived. He went 5-7 his first year and 8-5 in his 2nd year IN THE BIG 12.   If he wasn't recruiting well, his seat would have been very hot. Lost a lot of games he shouldn't have. Got blown out by Arkansas @ Arkansas.  Texas is interesting. I think they are a very good team, but probably not as good as everyone thinks they are.  The Michigan win doesn't look nearly as good as people thought a few weeks ago.  OU and Georgia will tell a lot in the next two weeks. 

That argument that Auburn is depleted of talent is old and tired. How in the world can u put a coach on the hot seat when the team is showing improvement. Cmon man. However the would have doesn’t matter because Texas has arrived so when should Auburn be expecting double digit wins

[e808 3,307]

47 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

I specifically do want to use Sark.  Texas was not nearly as talent depleted when he got to Austin as Auburn was when Freeze arrived. He went 5-7 his first year and 8-5 in his 2nd year IN THE BIG 12.   If he wasn't recruiting well, his seat would have been very hot. Lost a lot of games he shouldn't have. Got blown out by Arkansas @ Arkansas.  Texas is interesting. I think they are a very good team, but probably not as good as everyone thinks they are.  The Michigan win doesn't look nearly as good as people thought a few weeks ago.  OU and Georgia will tell a lot in the next two weeks. 

Texas went into the big house and destroyed them. Beat them in every phase. Not many teams getting a win there. See USC. We all know winning on the road is a tall task against any team with a pulse. Based on how UGA been playing Texas will beat them and it might be convincingly if UGA doesn’t get it together 

[Cardin Drake 2,085]

8 minutes ago, e808 said:

That argument that Auburn is depleted of talent is old and tired. How in the world can u put a coach on the hot seat when the team is showing improvement. Cmon man. However the would have doesn’t matter because Texas has arrived so when should Auburn be expecting double digit wins

Texas fired Tom Herman for going 7-3.  Sark came in and went 4-7 and 3-6 in the Big 12 conference.  Guess he should have been fired for failing to show improvement. 

[Cardin Drake 2,085]

3 minutes ago, e808 said:

Texas went into the big house and destroyed them. Beat them in every phase. Not many teams getting a win there. See USC. We all know winning on the road is a tall task against any team with a pulse. Based on how UGA been playing Texas will beat them and it might be convincingly if UGA doesn’t get it together 

I hope so. We will see. Texas hasn't truly been tested yet though. I do think Georgia has a better D than Texas.  Gotta get past the red river rivalry first.  The favorite is frequently upset there. 

Edited October 6 by Cardin Drake

[Hank2020 3,429]

1 minute ago, Cardin Drake said:

I hope so. We will see. Texas hasn't truly been tested yet though.  Gotta get past the red river rivalry first.  The favorite is frequently upset there. 

But even if they don’t win a national championship this year, they show a possible path.

[e808 3,307]

7 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

Texas fired Tom Herman for going 7-3.  Sark came in and went 4-7 and 3-6 in the Big 12 conference.  Guess he should have been fired for failing to show improvement. 

 It’s still his first . What did he do the following season.  CHF didn’t improve his first season and current trajectory to do worse than last year. All  I know is Texas was in the playoffs. When should we be seeing Auburn make an appearance. It’s all good respect ur opinion. We can agree to disagree 

Edited October 6 by e808

[metafour 5,094]

53 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

You didn't answer the question. Do you think we will be better off in two years if we replace Freeze now?  Are you actually arguing for that? 

I haven't made a single post suggesting that Freeze needs to be fired.

He gets 3 years regardless.

I am simply telling you that his tenure has started horribly on the place where it actually matters: the football field. Recruiting will blow away like a fart in the wind if he doesn't show SERIOUS improvement next season on the football field. So will his already signed talent. Top recruits aren't sitting around through 3-6 win seasons in years 2-3 when they can transfer anywhere, and get paid to do it.

 

[Cardin Drake 2,085]

Just now, metafour said:

I haven't made a single post suggesting that Freeze needs to be fired.

He gets 3 years regardless.

I am simply telling you that his tenure has started horribly on the place where it actually matters: the football field. Recruiting will blow away like a fart in the wind if he doesn't show SERIOUS improvement next season on the football field. So will his already signed talent. Top recruits aren't sitting around through 3-6 win seasons in years 2-3 when they can transfer anywhere, and get paid to do it.

 

A coach gets fired when the negativity surrounding his program starts to affect recruiting. You don't have much choice at that point.  Hugh is not immune from that. The results on the field have been disappointing to say the least.  But I still like the direction we are headed.  We will see better results next year, and I think we still grab some underdog wins this year.  

Texas is a very good team, I think, but it is going to be interesting to see how they fare in the weekly grind of the SEC. They drew a pretty fortunate schedule this year, but Ark, Kentucky, Vandy, and A&M are all looking a little more challenging than they did a week ago.  

[Hank2020 3,429]

16 minutes ago, e808 said:

 It’s still his first . What did he do the following season.  CHF didn’t improve his first season and current trajectory to do worse than last year. All  I know is Texas was in the playoffs. When should we be seeing Auburn make an appearance. It’s all good respect ur opinion. We can agree to disagree 

If we had their QB’s or just one of them, we would look more like them.

[DAG 35,374]

22 minutes ago, Cardin Drake said:

Texas fired Tom Herman for going 7-3.  Sark came in and went 4-7 and 3-6 in the Big 12 conference.  Guess he should have been fired for failing to show improvement. 

That was his first year bud. What did he do his second and then his third year?  This literally is a terrible example. 

[Hank2020 3,429]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

That was his first year bud. What did he do his second and then his third year?  This literally is a terrible example. 

I don’t follow, sorry for my ignorance.

[DAG 35,374]

Just now, Hank2020 said:

I don’t follow, sorry for my ignorance.

I am actually confused as what this poster is trying to prove with the Sark should’ve been fired after his first year at Texas. My point was he sucked his first year , improved his second year and his third year got them to the college playoffs. He showed steady improvement every year.