Much deeper than we think

[AUght2win 7,176]

29 minutes ago, Viper said:

Lot of ifs and two Ls as a result.

Then how did AU go from 5-5-1 in 1992 to 11-0 in 1993?

And 3-8 in 2012 to 12-2 in 2013?

It’s been proven before and it’ll be proven again at AU.

Viper you’re not reading. At least not everything I’m posting. The point of my first “if” comment was exactly that - LOTS of things are going wrong.

Secondly, 1993 and 2013 HAD NEW CULTURES. They had new coaches who got rid of the funk. Hugh hasn’t gotten rid of the Harsin culture of losing. It’s STILL there. And make no mistake - it’s Hugh fault.

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

36 minutes ago, Viper said:

Lot of ifs and two Ls as a result.

Then how did AU go from 5-5-1 in 1992 to 11-0 in 1993?

And 3-8 in 2012 to 12-2 in 2013?

It’s been proven before and it’ll be proven again at AU.

Because those 2 teams had national championship talent, and experience that needed a change agent to bring out their potential. Those circumstances don't come around often. On the other hand Freeze walked into a complete wasteland. 

[aucom96 1,662]

1 hour ago, Shadow Tiger said:

Because those 2 teams had national championship talent, and experience that needed a change agent to bring out their potential. Those circumstances don't come around often. On the other hand Freeze walked into a complete wasteland. 

So did Tuberville in 99. Year two, he was 9-4. That 93 Bowden team had two losing seasons before he took the reigns. Dye took over a 5 win team and went 9-3 in year two. Freeze walked into a problem, but he hasn't helped himself either. 

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

14 minutes ago, aucom96 said:

So did Tuberville in 99. Year two, he was 9-4. That 93 Bowden team had two losing seasons before he took the reigns. Dye took over a 5 win team and went 9-3 in year two. Freeze walked into a problem, but he hasn't helped himself either. 

As bad as the recruiting was under Bowden, Tubbs still walked into a better situation than Freeze. The 2 losing seasons before Bowden came in was a result of Dye being in bad health at the time, and the Eric Ramsey investigation. 

[tigeraddikt 1,788]

2 minutes ago, Shadow Tiger said:

As bad as the recruiting was under Bowden, Tubbs still walked into a better situation than Freeze. The 2 losing seasons before Bowden came in was a result of Dye being in bad health at the time, and the Eric Ramsey investigation. 

I always wondered why the 91-92 Dye Auburn teams dropped off. I knew about the Ramsey investigation, but 1990 had seen Stan White and a retooled roster play pretty well and get a bowl win. Please elaborate with details about how the end of the Dye era kinda fizzled.

[cbo 9,056]

7 hours ago, auburnatl1 said:

I understand. My only point is basic competent qb play and imo we beat cal and arky. Not even close.   We’re confusing what takes to beat a uga with a vast blue chip roster, vs beating an arky. 2 different problems. 

A lot of culture and mojo can be quickly fixed with a qb.

Exactly right. QB should be the top priority of every coach, all the time. 

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

51 minutes ago, tigeraddikt said:

I always wondered why the 91-92 Dye Auburn teams dropped off. I knew about the Ramsey investigation, but 1990 had seen Stan White and a retooled roster play pretty well and get a bowl win. Please elaborate with details about how the end of the Dye era kinda fizzled.

You're correct, the 90 team was a rebuild led by freshman Stan White. The team still had a winning record topped off with a Peach Bowl win against Indiana. I can't give you any exact details about behind the scenes in 91 and 92, but I'm sure there's someone on the board that can. It wouldn't make sense for a team to regress like it did, unless you had distractions as I stated in my above post.

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

17 minutes ago, cbo said:

Exactly right. QB should be the top priority of every coach, all the time. 

You're right. Freeze made a gamble, and it's not gonna work out this year. We can only hope a QB will be available that's worth going after at the end of the year. At the same time we gotta keep building up, especially in the trenches. 

[TripleDegreeTiger 281]

2 hours ago, Shadow Tiger said:

You're right. Freeze made a gamble, and it's not gonna work out this year. We can only hope a QB will be available that's worth going after at the end of the year. At the same time we gotta keep building up, especially in the trenches. 

Better start putting away the money and don't buy any AU Nike gear. Gabriel will be done in college and Phil Knight will be funding another transfer to Oregon lol.

[aucom96 1,662]

10 hours ago, Shadow Tiger said:

As bad as the recruiting was under Bowden, Tubbs still walked into a better situation than Freeze.

Somewhat, maybe. He had an underperforming QB with not much behind him, less talented backs, better oline, one good receiver and an average defense. It was similar enough to point out the difference in what appears to be trending toward a second losing season and a 9 win second season. Tuberville knew what he had and played to his strengths. I don't know that Hugh Freeze has any idea of what his strengths even are. 

[Viper 3,595]

20 hours ago, AUght2win said:

Viper you’re not reading. At least not everything I’m posting. The point of my first “if” comment was exactly that - LOTS of things are going wrong.

Secondly, 1993 and 2013 HAD NEW CULTURES. They had new coaches who got rid of the funk. Hugh hasn’t gotten rid of the Harsin culture of losing. It’s STILL there. And make no mistake - it’s Hugh fault.

Oh I read it. I read a LOT of “ifs” to beat ARK. Absolutely no one…not you…not me…NO ONE knows IF we beat ARK given IF any of your ifs come to fruition  

I’ve stated countless times…LONG before AU ever thought about hiring Freeze…on the field, he is Gus 2.0. He has proven that correctly thus far.

I’ve also stated recruiting will fix this.

 

[AuCivilEng1 12,661]

Didn’t know where to put this but I realllly hope that this isn’t true. If so, wtf are they doing over there?

Seems like there is a lot of drama stirring up lately.

[Viper 3,595]

21 hours ago, Shadow Tiger said:

Because those 2 teams had national championship talent, and experience that needed a change agent to bring out their potential. Those circumstances don't come around often. On the other hand Freeze walked into a complete wasteland. 

Agreed with the wasteland. However, I will say both 1993 and 2013, on average amongst fans and media, pre-season, had slightly less expectations than 2024.

[TD1 249]

11 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Didn’t know where to put this but I realllly hope that this isn’t true. If so, wtf are they doing over there?

Seems like there is a lot of drama stirring up lately.

 

Also....

Edited September 23 by TD1

[AuCivilEng1 12,661]

9 minutes ago, TD1 said:

 

Also....

Dude wtf. What is wrong with the people at the top? Hugh was supposed to be the remedy to that type of bullsh*t. 

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

14 minutes ago, Viper said:

Agreed with the wasteland. However, I will say both 1993 and 2013, on average amongst fans and media, pre-season, had slightly less expectations than 2024.

I was uncertain about 93, but I was of the belief Auburn was a team stuck in the mud, and not completely wrecked at 2012. Malzahn came back to coach his players he recruited to run his offense. He just needed a QB and got it with Nick Marshall. 

[JerryAU 1,962]

21 minutes ago, TD1 said:

 

Also....

Hold up!  Are these posts seriously from Sept 2024 (Freeze/Cohen) and not Sept 2022 (Harsin/Greene)??? WTH?

This is appalling when I watch other games, and the TV cameras spot current NFL players walking the sidelines with their sideline passes every flipping week at other SEC programs.  Why in the world would we not welcome former brothers' home to Auburn?  Let them enjoy the complex, visit amongst themselves, help recruit the "Auburn" brand show the young players and future prospects what it means to be a part of the Auburn Family. 

[Viper 3,595]

23 minutes ago, Shadow Tiger said:

I was uncertain about 93, but I was of the belief Auburn was a team stuck in the mud, and not completely wrecked at 2012. Malzahn came back to coach his players he recruited to run his offense. He just needed a QB and got it with Nick Marshall. 

2012 might have been the most wrecked team in AU history. All the arrests, which led to policed curfews…an absolute dumpster fire. Had the transfer portal been in place, half the team would have ran like inmates escaping a prison.

Marshall absolutely made the offense ultra dynamic, but he nor Mason could have racked up their lofty stats without their OLine. Chiz’ staff recruited OLine really well in 2010/2011 and it paid off.

2024 is void of any OLine talent similar to 2013.

Edited September 23 by Viper

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

28 minutes ago, Viper said:

2012 might have been the most wrecked team in AU history. All the arrests, which led to policed curfews…an absolute dumpster fire. Had the transfer portal been in place, half the team would have ran like inmates escaping a prison.

Marshall absolutely made the offense ultra dynamic, but he nor Mason could have racked up their lofty stats without their OLine. Chiz’ staff recruited OLine really well in 2010/2011 and it paid off.

2024 is void of any OLine talent similar to 2013.

No doubt 😃 Chiz lost the locker room, and pulled a Terry Bowden with the offense.

[JuscAUse! 1,736]

On 9/22/2024 at 6:18 PM, AUght2win said:

Viper you’re not reading. At least not everything I’m posting. The point of my first “if” comment was exactly that - LOTS of things are going wrong.

Secondly, 1993 and 2013 HAD NEW CULTURES. They had new coaches who got rid of the funk. Hugh hasn’t gotten rid of the Harsin culture of losing. It’s STILL there. And make no mistake - it’s Hugh fault.

Wrong on 93 for sure. Bowden had Dyes recruits that grew up and learned the game in 92. I can't remember how, but we missed badly one year in recruiting, had the BS from Bamaham going on during the season, and then AU getting penalized for freaking groceries. Bowden had a great situation his first year. The culture was built when he got there, and it took a few years for him to ruin it. 

But... he was a great play caller with someone else's recruits. Maybe as good as I've seen. 

Edited September 24 by JuscAUse!

[Viper 3,595]

3 hours ago, Shadow Tiger said:

No doubt 😃 Chiz lost the locker room, and pulled a Terry Bowden with the offense.

Or Tubbs (w the 6-game Tony Franklin experiment).

[Shadow Tiger 1,647]

1 hour ago, Viper said:

Or Tubbs (w the 6-game Tony Franklin experiment).

The experiment wasn't bad. What was bad was Tubbs not telling his people to get in line. He allowed them to undermine Franklin, and then gave Franklin the boot. 

[naildawg 120]

On 9/23/2024 at 4:28 PM, AuCivilEng1 said:

Didn’t know where to put this but I realllly hope that this isn’t true. If so, wtf are they doing over there?

Seems like there is a lot of drama stirring up lately.

The Harsin clown car drives on.

[Cardin Drake 2,091]

These sweeping generalizations remind me of what I've been reading on Texas' bulletin boards for years about deep problems, selfish players, and rot in the program. As soon as Sark and NIL came and started recruiting lights out, suddenly all the culture issues were somehow fixed.  What is wrong with Auburn today is the leftover effect of Harsin's historically disastrous recruiting classes of 2021 and 2022, and to a lesser extent 2020. Other than running back (thanks, Cadillac!), those classes were just terrible. This isn't going to be fixed overnight, but one or two more classes like 2024 & 2025 will fix it, period.   The only question left is whether Hugh can hold the recruiting together given the results on the field. If he can, we'll be fine.  

[tbone4jc 2,500]

Losing mentality is over used. Does anyone remember the mass exodus of most of our best players under potato head? The abysmal recruiting that happened? We just don’t have the Jimmy’s and Joe’s yet! ‘23 class was a rush to get as many as possible and had a few very good players but a lot of avg or below  players. ‘24 is the first class that CHF recruited when he had time to connect with top talent. ‘25 will be as good or better. That’s only 1 1/2 cycle in the rebuild. ‘24 Transfer portal was focused to fill as many holes as possible, esp. the OLine. ‘25 was focused on defense but wiffed on a QB. It also takes time to blend talent into a cohesive team, that happens with game time experiences.
 
Common sense points that these bumps against Cal and Ark are losses due to bad decision making by the QB and lack of experience working together. Also We have new OC and DC, DLine coaches.  Even with that The offense is averaging over 400 yards per game. The OLine is improving every week. .
I believe we will be where we all want soon. I also believe the ship will correct its course this season when we stop turning the ball over and win 6-7 games. If not, it’s not the end of the world as long as we keep recruiting at a high level the wins will come.