Gotta admit

[DKW 86 7,946]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

That's a misleading "factoid" David.

When Trump took office, there were zero pandemic deaths.  When Biden took office, the pandemic was raging full bore.

You expect the course of the pandemic to suddenly reverse itself because we had a new president? 

That is nonsensical.

I plainly, factually, state that trump only dealt with the pandemic for 9 months, and Biden dealt with it for 17. 

The time alone could account for the difference. It is plain truth that more people died under Biden than trump, if for nothing but time alone. It is also true that more people have now died vaccinated than died unvaccinated. Both are factual and just a function of time.

Go invent something else to whine about. 

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

49 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

This just seems mean spirited. I know politics is a frustrating thing, but cmon man.

You know what, man. You're right. I shouldn't have said that. This absurd cult like behavior has gotten beyond frustrating, but I should have been better. 

You want to know what else is mean spirited?

• Calling gay and trans people "groomers, pedophiles, and mentally deranged"
• Insinuating that Barack Obama isn't an American citizen, with zero evidence.
• Accusing Democrats and liberal people of being pedophiles and baby killers
• Treating middle American refugees like they're animals
• Saying that you honestly believe that someone has dementia and then promptly making fun of them constantly ("Bumbling Biden")
• Referring to people you disagree with as "dogs" and "pigs"

 

Yes, I should hold myself to a higher standard. We all should. But a lot of people on this forum and in this country are going to go to the ballot box and vote for that^^^^

So I'll make you a deal. I'll be nicer and more respectful to all my Trump cult brothers and sisters if they agree to not vote for any candidate that does  or says stuff on that list. You in?

Edited June 29, 2023 by AuCivilEng1

[KansasTiger 3,280]

2 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

You know what, man. You're right. I shouldn't have said that. This absurd cult like behavior has gotten beyond frustrating, but I should have been better. 

I want to know what else is mean spirited?

• Calling gay and trans people "groomers, pedophiles, and mentally deranged"
• Insinuating that Barack Obama isn't an American citizen, with zero evidence.
• Accusing Democrats and liberal people of being pedophiles and baby killers
• Treating middle American refugees like they're animals
• Saying that you honestly believe that someone has dementia and then promptly making fun of them constantly ("Bumbling Biden")
• Referring to people you disagree with as "dogs" and "pigs"

 

Yes, I should hold myself to a higher standard. We all should. But a lot of people on this forum and in this country are going to go to the ballot box and vote for that^^^^

So I'll make you a deal. I'll be nicer and more respectful to all my Trump cult brothers and sisters if they agree to not vote for any candidate that does  or says stuff on that list. You in?

I honestly hope we don't have to vote for either candidate. I dont think i have a problem with most of your list. Over generalizations are almost always a bad thing. There are certain situations where i would argue a conversation about specific cases can be warranted without it getting into a generalized hate fest. I.e., are the people at this drag show grooming kids by doing this in front of them? We should be able to talk about it civilly without that immediatley being called hateful. As opposed to saying all trans people groom kids. Not ok.

Ive always thought the position biden has been put in is tantamount to elder abuse. That or hes a mastermind running everything and he uses this as some amazing disguise or facade. Not even sure i could be mad at that, just kinda impressed. Im probably just as guilty as anyone as poking fun at someone who i honestly believe has dementia, but either he, or someone pulling his strings, put him(self) in the most visible job in the world knowing he had these issues. Scrutiny comes with the territory. I think the criticism gets delivered with an edged sword due to most liberals not budging much on the issue that he has severe and limiting declining mental capability that should probably DQ him from the job, or at least be discussed seriously, which it's mostly just kept to conservative circles. That probably doesn't mean it's ok, but it can't be that he doesn't have dementia AND we have to give him the sympathy of someone who has it.

Are there people calling each other pigs and dogs on this forum? I hope not.

I get your frustration and I respect that you have a compassionate heart.

If it makes you feel better, I can almost garauntee Trump won't be president imo. Biden either, but I'm less sure of that.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

4 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

Are there people calling each other pigs and dogs on this forum? I hope not.

I don't know, but I know Trump has, and nobody seems to have a problem with it. In fact, I've gotten more pushback from conservatives (just you the one time) for saying that to Mikey, than Trump got from conservatives for referring to people as pigs and dogs.

[KansasTiger 3,280]

2 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

I don't know, but I know Trump has, and nobody seems to have a problem with it. In fact, I've gotten more pushback from conservatives (just you the one time) for saying that to Mikey, than Trump got from conservatives for referring to people as pigs and dogs.

Trump should get pushback. More than he gets. But I think you've seen most conservatives on this forum abandon that Trump train as a result of alot of his actions or inaction. It may not be that out loud pushback you were looking for, but I think actions eventually have consequences.

But I'm hoping we start seeing more dems push back on Biden, too. So he might act more civil, but I think he's got as many sins under that vernier as Trump, on top of his inability to continue to function as a CIC. So let's just all agree...ditch BOTH these awful candidates and vote for RFK?

...I had to try...

[Mikey 16,781]

13 hours ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

. In Biden’s 10-plus months, the United States has accounted for less than 12 percent of worldwide deaths, which is down from 19.9 percent under Trump. That’s a decline of more than 40 percent in our proportion of the worldwide death rate.

Not because of anything Bungling Biden did. Thank Trump's Operation Warp Speed for the improved U.S. stats. Also, your stats are fraudulent as presented. They make no account for increased deaths in other countries as the virus spread.

13 hours ago, Gowebb11 said:

Fauci and the CDC dropped the ball on a lot of things. But it was Trump who called it a hoax and was quoted as saying we had 15 cases and would soon be at zero. So according to Trump, there was no pandemic. It didn’t even exist. Right before it killed a million Americans. Nothing Fauci said or did can compare to Trumps denial of reality. The ball was dropped big time, again on both sides. 

At the time Trump made that statement it could well have been a hoax. Thankfully, as soon as it became apparent that the threat was real, Trump pulled American medicine, industry and the military together and got us the vaccine in a hurry. Can you imagine the mess Bungling Biden would have made in a time of crisis? He'd have probably named the Giggling Hyena the "COVID Czar" and wandered off to the wrong stage exit.

10 hours ago, homersapien said:

The economy has created 13 million jobs, inflation has been more than cut in half, huge investments are being made in infrastructure and green energy, wage growth has begun to outpace inflation, the first drug price controls are going into effect and the biggest corporations will finally be forced to pay something in federal taxes. Yet polls show voters incorrectly think we are in a recession and remain negative about the economy.

Real wages have declined for 26 straight months under Biden. Those 13 million jobs weren't created, they were replacing jobs that people lost due to COVID restrictions. What manner of math says that inflation going from 1.4% to first 9% and now an additional 5% more under Biden is cutting it in half? Surely that's a joke. Voters are negative about the economy because the economy is negative. Their paychecks won't buy what they would even a few months ago.

[homersapien 12,310]

18 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

That is nonsensical.

I plainly, factually, state that trump only dealt with the pandemic for 9 months, and Biden dealt with it for 17. 

The time alone could account for the difference. It is plain truth that more people died under Biden than trump, if for nothing but time alone. It is also true that more people have now died vaccinated than died unvaccinated. Both are factual and just a function of time.

Go invent something else to whine about. 

Yes, I see that now.  Thanks for clarifying.

But the statement was presented as a stand alone statement without a direct (immediate) qualification so I interpreted it as such. That may be nit-picking but you can't just assume someone is going to connect whatever you wrote in the rest of your post with it. Sorry, my bad. 

And I am not "whining".  I am simply providing you some feedback on how it's likely to be interpreted it based on the way it was presented.

Your welcome.

Edited June 30, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 12,310]

17 hours ago, KansasTiger said:

I honestly hope we don't have to vote for either candidate. I dont think i have a problem with most of your list. Over generalizations are almost always a bad thing. There are certain situations where i would argue a conversation about specific cases can be warranted without it getting into a generalized hate fest. I.e., are the people at this drag show grooming kids by doing this in front of them? We should be able to talk about it civilly without that immediatley being called hateful. As opposed to saying all trans people groom kids. Not ok.

Ive always thought the position biden has been put in is tantamount to elder abuse. That or hes a mastermind running everything and he uses this as some amazing disguise or facade. Not even sure i could be mad at that, just kinda impressed. Im probably just as guilty as anyone as poking fun at someone who i honestly believe has dementia, but either he, or someone pulling his strings, put him(self) in the most visible job in the world knowing he had these issues. Scrutiny comes with the territory. I think the criticism gets delivered with an edged sword due to most liberals not budging much on the issue that he has severe and limiting declining mental capability that should probably DQ him from the job, or at least be discussed seriously, which it's mostly just kept to conservative circles. That probably doesn't mean it's ok, but it can't be that he doesn't have dementia AND we have to give him the sympathy of someone who has it.

Are there people calling each other pigs and dogs on this forum? I hope not.

I get your frustration and I respect that you have a compassionate heart.

If it makes you feel better, I can almost garauntee Trump won't be president imo. Biden either, but I'm less sure of that.

Keep in mind that Biden was elected as a choice between him and Trump.

And while you may "honestly believe" Biden has dementia, I "honestly believe" Trump is a narcissistic sociopath. 😉

 

 

[KansasTiger 3,280]

17 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Keep in mind that Biden was elected as a choice between him and Trump.

And while you may "honestly believe" Biden has dementia, I "honestly believe" Trump is a narcissistic sociopath. 😉

 

 

Oh he is completely a narcissist. 

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

34 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Keep in mind that Biden was elected as a choice between him and Trump.

And while you may "honestly believe" Biden has dementia, I "honestly believe" Trump is a narcissistic sociopath. 😉

 

 

Biden doesn't have dementia. He's just old af. Joe Biden has always always always not been good with words. There is a long history of him misspeaking and frankly being a bit of a bumbler. 

The part that bothers me is that the same people that profess to be caring "Christian" individuals are making fun of him while simultaneously saying that he has serious dementia.  I feel bad for those people's grandparents and parents, who may have or develop dementia at some point. 

The other part that bothers me is that these fools act like Donald Trump in some spritely charismatic public speaker. DONALD TRUMP IS 3 years 7 months YOUNGER THAN BIDEN!  He's clinically classified as morbidly obese. And there is also very real and compelling evidence that supports the theory Trump is addicted to prescription drugs and used to do cocaine like every other rich maniac from the 70's and 80's. He also lives on a steady diet of Diet Coke and fast food. That is a documented fact. The guy is a ticking timebomb healthwise. If he wasn't a billionaire with access to the best doctors in the world, he'd probably be dead by now. The stresses of prison are going to do him in. 

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by AuCivilEng1

[KansasTiger 3,280]

2 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Biden doesn't have dementia. He's just old af. Joe Biden has always always always not been good with words. There is a long history of him misspeaking and frankly being a bit of a bumbler. 

The part that bothers me is that the same people that profess to be caring "Christian" individuals are making fun of him while simultaneously saying that he has serious dementia.  I feel bad for those people's grandparents and parents, who may have or develop dementia at some point. 

The other part that bothers me is that these fools act like Donald Trump in some spritely charismatic public speaker. DONALD TRUMP IS 3 years 7 months YOUNGER THAN BIDEN!  And there is also very real and compelling evidence that supports the theory Trump is addicted to prescription drugs and used to do cocaine like every other rich maniac from the 70's and 80's. He also lives on a steady diet of Diet Coke and fast food. That is a documented fact. 

 

I think its unfair to allude that people critical of the president of the US would mistreat their parents and grandparents because of that behavior. This is a charged political environment where jabs and discussion can get heated, and sometimes that influences how people respond. And our comments have little true affect on Biden. Yet, his cognitive decline can have real world implications on us. That will, by nature, come with scrutiny and ridicule like every president has received.

But it's a low blow to then use that to allude that people that say these things are possibly abusing their own parents/grandparents. Thats similar to republicans massive assumption that because you protect drag shows right to perform with children present youre pro child molestation. I can be as guilty as anyone of this, so I say this to myself as well: We need to stop with all the demonizing of the other side.

I also think many liberals equate pointing out horrendous mistakes Biden makes and saying it's dementia is picking on him, when it's not.

[homersapien 12,310]

19 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Biden doesn't have dementia. He's just old af. Joe Biden has always always always not been good with words. There is a long history of him misspeaking and frankly being a bit of a bumbler. 

The part that bothers me is that the same people that profess to be caring "Christian" individuals are making fun of him while simultaneously saying that he has serious dementia.  I feel bad for those people's grandparents and parents, who may have or develop dementia at some point. 

The other part that bothers me is that these fools act like Donald Trump in some spritely charismatic public speaker. DONALD TRUMP IS 3 years 7 months YOUNGER THAN BIDEN!  And there is also very real and compelling evidence that supports the theory Trump is addicted to prescription drugs and used to do cocaine like every other rich maniac from the 70's and 80's. He also lives on a steady diet of Diet Coke and fast food. That is a documented fact. 

 

I agree completely.  Biden's mental capacity is likely diminished somewhat - I will readily admit that at 72, mine has, but it's mostly in areas like memory (like spelling), not cognitive thinking. (No doubt I'll get some push back on the latter from trolls. 😉

Whatever Biden's decline, it's more than made up for in his experience and temperament.  And frankly, I'd bet on Biden vs. Trump in a cognitive test showdown.  Trump is just as old practically speaking (older than me) and has a lot more psychological pathology baggage.

And then there is Biden's clear advantage in making good appointments to run the country. Trump's stated goals are to disrupt and weaponize government and I take him seriously. 

Simply stated, the country cannot afford another Trump presidency.

Edited June 30, 2023 by homersapien

[KansasTiger 3,280]

4 minutes ago, homersapien said:

I agree completely.  Biden's mental capacity is likely diminished somewhat - I will readily admit that at 72, mine has, but it's mostly in areas like memory, not cognitive thinking. (No doubt I'll get some push back on the latter from trolls. 😉

Whatever Biden's decline, it's more than made up for in his experience and temperament.  And frankly, I'd bet on Biden vs. Trump in a cognitive test showdown.  Trump is just as old practically speaking (older than me) and has a lot more psychological pathology baggage.

And then there is Biden's clear advantage in making good appointments to run the country. Trump's stated goals are to disrupt and weaponize government and I take him seriously. 

Simply stated, the country cannot afford another Trump presidency.

If we're making some assumptions here, it's known Biden has had a few brain surgeries. It's quite possible that played a factor on top of age to his mental decline, that might actually be affecting more than just memory. It's hard to know for sure, and we will never get an honest answer from the administration. 

Theyre both too old to be president. I'm tired of this he's better than Trump narrative when we haven't even had primaries yet. Now is the time we can fix this by getting good candidates, if people in both parties would pull their heads out of their a**. Push for someone better than Biden, just like you implore the right to push for someone better than Trump.

Edited June 30, 2023 by KansasTiger

[homersapien 12,310]

15 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

I think its unfair to allude that people critical of the president of the US would mistreat their parents and grandparents because of that behavior. This is a charged political environment where jabs and discussion can get heated, and sometimes that influences how people respond. And our comments have little true affect on Biden. Yet, his cognitive decline can have real world implications on us. That will, by nature, come with scrutiny and ridicule like every president has received.

But it's a low blow to then use that to allude that people that say these things are possibly abusing their own parents/grandparents. Thats similar to republicans massive assumption that because you protect drag shows right to perform with children present youre pro child molestation. I can be as guilty as anyone of this, so I say this to myself as well: We need to stop with all the demonizing of the other side.

I also think many liberals equate pointing out horrendous mistakes Biden makes and saying it's dementia is picking on him, when it's not.

The accusation of "dementia" does however indicated a hyperbolic perspective of the (gradual) mental decline that comes with old age. It's completely unfounded and totally over-the-top in Biden's case.

And let's not forget we have actually had a serving POTUS with at least early dementia in Ronald Reagan.  Again, the surrounding cast becomes primary in that cases. 

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 12,310]

8 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

If we're making some assumptions here, it's known Biden has had a few brain surgeries. It's quite possible that played a factor on top of age to his mental decline, that might actually be affecting more than just memory. It's hard to know for sure, and we will never get an honest answer from the administration. 

Theyre both too old to be president. I'm tired of this he's better than Trump narrative when we haven't even had primaries yet. Now is the time we can fix this by getting good candidates, if people in both parties would pull their heads out of their a**. Push for someone better than Biden, just like you implore the right to push for someone better than Trump.

I'd like to see a younger replacement for Biden also.  But again, if it comes down to a chose between him and Trump I am quite comfortable choosing Biden.  (I am also quite comfortable choosing Biden over DeSantis, for what it's worth.)

Now, someone like Will Hurd is a different situation.

Edited June 30, 2023 by homersapien

[KansasTiger 3,280]

1 minute ago, homersapien said:

I'd like to see a younger replacement for Biden also.  But again, if it comes down to a chose between him and Trump I am quite comfortable choosing Biden.

(I am also quite comfortable choosing Biden over DeSantis, for what it's worth.)

So it's safe to say policies over the candidate is your primary focus?

[homersapien 12,310]

1 minute ago, KansasTiger said:

So it's safe to say policies over the candidate is your primary focus?

Well, I'd say character, temperament and values are at least on par with policy, if not primary.  

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

1 minute ago, KansasTiger said:

I also think many liberals equate pointing out horrendous mistakes Biden makes and saying it's dementia is picking on him, when it's not.

I am not insinuating that anyone would abuse their parents. But anyone who casually calls someone "bumbling Biden", and acts like he doesn't know what planet he's on, and then promptly voices real concerns about him having dementia isn't being genuine about one or the other. They also seem to be ok with a world where treating people with dementia like that is ok (hence the comment about me feeling sorry for their family members). They have no leg to stand on to defend their parents from these comments if they are guilty of the same thing. 

 

Yet, his cognitive decline can have real world implications on us

Cognitive decline in one member of a government has A LOT less implications on us than someone who is willing to share classified nuclear and invasion documents with a f*ing reporter and I KNOW that you are intelligent enough to know that.  Biden bumbling is nothing in comparison to that. 

 

I also think many liberals equate pointing out horrendous mistakes Biden makes and saying it's dementia is picking on him, when it's not.

The word liberals and Biden in this comment can be replaced with conservatives and Trump and it wouldn't miss a beat. This isn't just a liberal problem. The difference is that Trump has a long history of picking on people (handicapped people, women, Hispanics, black people, PARENTS of VETERANS, etc). He refers to people as dogs and pigs. He brings it onto himself. Joe Biden, Barack Obama, GWB are all decent men with a heart who love and respect their family. 

[KansasTiger 3,280]

3 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

I am not insinuating that anyone would abuse their parents. But anyone who casually calls someone "bumbling Biden", and acts like he doesn't know what planet he's on, and then promptly voices real concerns about him having dementia isn't being genuine about one or the other. They also seem to be ok with a world where treating people with dementia like that is ok (hence the comment about me feeling sorry for their family members). They have no leg to stand on to defend their parents from these comments if they are guilty of the same thing. 

 

Yet, his cognitive decline can have real world implications on us

Cognitive decline in one member of a government has A LOT less implications on us than someone who is willing to share classified nuclear and invasion documents with a f*ing reporter and I KNOW that you are intelligent enough to know that.  Biden bumbling is nothing in comparison to that. 

 

I also think many liberals equate pointing out horrendous mistakes Biden makes and saying it's dementia is picking on him, when it's not.

The word liberals and Biden in this comment can be replaced with conservatives and Trump and it wouldn't miss a beat. This isn't just a liberal problem. The difference is that Trump has a long history of picking on people (handicapped people, women, Hispanics, black people, PARENTS of VETERANS, etc). He refers to people as dogs and pigs. He brings it onto himself. Joe Biden, Barack Obama, GWB are all decent men with a heart who love and respect their family. 

I'm. Not. Defending. Trump.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

Just now, KansasTiger said:

I'm. Not. Defending. Trump.

I get that you don't like Trump. I do not categorize you as a MAGA cult member like some of the marks on here. *cough cough mikey cough*

You have to understand though that, speaking from my perspective, and I think I can speak for guys like @homersapienand @CoffeeTigeron this, refusing to acknowledge the very real and documented danger of reelecting Trump, whoever he is running against, is a defense of Trump. In my mind, someone who will vote for him if he's the republican nominee is ultimately accomplishing the same thing as the knuckleheads that go to his rallies in their ridiculous Chinese made Trump garb.

[KansasTiger 3,280]

9 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

I get that you don't like Trump. I do not categorize you as a MAGA cult member like some of the marks on here. *cough cough mikey cough*

You have to understand though that, speaking from my perspective, and I think I can speak for guys like @homersapienand @CoffeeTigeron this, refusing to acknowledge the very real and documented danger of reelecting Trump, whoever he is running against, is a defense of Trump. In my mind, someone who will vote for him if he's the republican nominee is ultimately accomplishing the same thing as the knuckleheads that go to his rallies in their ridiculous Chinese made Trump garb.

I understand that perspective. I'm not sure I can vote for either candidate. At least i have time to think about it. I view them as equally bad.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

1 minute ago, KansasTiger said:

I understand that perspective. I'm not sure I can vote for either candidate. At least i have time to think about it. I view them as equally bad.

In a perfect world (for me at least) the two tickets would be..

Democrats - P Gavin Newsom VP Elizabeth Warren  OR Vice versa

GOP - P Liz Cheney VP Adam Kinzinger   Or Vice versa

I could walk away from that election feeling like we would be moving in the right direction either way. 

 

Dream ticket Jon Stewart/Liz Warren 🤩

[AU9377 6,109]

20 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

That is nonsensical.

I plainly, factually, state that trump only dealt with the pandemic for 9 months, and Biden dealt with it for 17. 

The time alone could account for the difference. It is plain truth that more people died under Biden than trump, if for nothing but time alone. It is also true that more people have now died vaccinated than died unvaccinated. Both are factual and just a function of time.

Go invent something else to whine about. 

My disgust is that Donald Trump made Covid a political issue.  Rather than lead, he acted like the self consumed child that he is at heart.  He always knew more than the most qualified infectious disease experts in the world.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/11/trumps-lies-about-coronavirus/608647/

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-10-17/trump-s-cdc-changed-weekly-reports-house-covid-panel-finds

[Gowebb11 10,035]

20 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

. It is also true that more people have now died vaccinated than died unvaccinated.

Source? 

[Gowebb11 10,035]

3 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

My disgust is that Donald Trump made Covid

I love that he declared it a hoax right  before he took credit for saving us from it. And his supporters can’t seem to put those pieces together.  A bit paradoxical.