Gotta admit

[TitanTiger 21,558]

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

The line started here:  his net worth when elected was around $800,000 and not worth $70 million and I thought his policies were to help the poor.

There's a difference in becoming popular and it ending up paying well and going into it for that reason.  I don't think the latter is the case with him.

 

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Trump is pure ego, but he will take anything thrown his way in terms of money.

Romney and McCain are the type of people that would run to better America, but interestedly enough they both lost badly

True.  But it would have taken an extraordinary candidate to beat Obama in those elections.  McCain was running against history and Obama was a dynamic candidate.  McCain looked old and past his prime by comparison.  And the debacle of the War on Terror under Bush was going to create drag for any GOP candidate.

Romney actually had a decent showing, pulling about 48% of the vote.  But the Democrats were highly motivated not to allow the first black president to be a one-and-done guy also.

 

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Your take on Biden is *head in the sand* bad.  Anybody that openly touts the idea of sterilizing children is evil.

Again, this isn't a list of people I think are right on everything or that didn't have terrible policy ideas.  We're talking about motivations for running.  Despite the fact that I think Joe is horribly, horribly wrong on children and trans issues for instance, I think he believes he's doing something good there.  I think he believes he's standing up for troubled people and anti discrimination.  Crazy enough, people can back deeply wrong ideas for good and laudable reasons.

 

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

To me DeSantis is a guy that wants to help America be, dare I say, great again.

Jury is out on him.  I think he's marginally better than Trump.  But he's styled himself so much after Trump (minus the extremely stupid things Trump says), it's hard to tell where he's coming from sometimes.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

12 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

To me DeSantis is a guy that wants to help America be, dare I say, great again.

Making America great again is a completely different concept, based on who you ask and when you ask it. Ron DeSantis would make America really great again for straight white evangelicals at the expense of everyone else who isn't that. A great president who can take America to the next level, has to have neutrality in both economic and social policies, or else there is always going to be a group that feels like they are getting stiffed. There are Republicans who fit that bill, but they are being ran out of the party by the people who don't. Whether anyone will admit it now or not Joe Biden absolutely fits the neutral economic and social policies, and has his entire career. He's too liberal for conservatives and too conservative for liberals.  But the other side is making him out to be some kind of radical Marxist, because he isn't uber conservative. Biden and Trump are too f***ing old to be running for president in 2024.

There have got to be some relatively young candidates out there who stand up for strong economic growth, while also not catering to billionaires and socially extreme people on either side. There just have to be. 

Edited June 27, 2023 by AuCivilEng1

[TitanTiger 21,558]

12 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Could you imagine what this board would be like without our masochistic tendencies?  There are two sides to a debate even though one side wants to silence any opposition.

Climb down off the cross.

[KansasTiger 3,280]

23 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Also, I'll say that even if some of them weren't pure altruists, there have been presidents and candidates in the general elections in my life that got this one mostly right.  They were running because they actually thought they could help and serve this country.  They might have been wrong around what was the best direction or course of action for the country at times, but their motives weren't for selfish gain or raw power.  Ones I would put in that category:

Gerald Ford
Jimmy Carter
Ronald Reagan
Walter Mondale
George H.W. Bush
Michael Dukakis
Bob Dole
George W. Bush (who I think is a good man but surrounded himself with some power hungry people unfortunately)
Barack Obama
John McCain
Mitt Romney

Jury is still out on Biden somewhat depending on what, if anything, else comes out on Hunter but my general feeling on Biden is that he's a decent man.

Again, this isn't a list of people I think had all the right ideas or I think in the broader picture would have been a good choice for president when they ran.  But it's a list of people I think who were fundamentally decent and who weren't running for office for primarily self-serving and power-hungry reasons.  But I do think these folks believed they could serve this country and help the people of it with their policies.

Here's my chance to say every politician on this list outside of maybe Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan is an awful person, and Carter was too incompetent to matter. I dont know enough about Ford to pass judgement.

Your take on Biden is horrendous. The difference between him and trump is trump says bad things and Biden doesn't, but instead just does bad things. Most you would rather have a president that just hides his crime better and speaks more like a politician.

[TitanTiger 21,558]

3 minutes ago, KansasTiger said:

Here's my chance to say every politician on this list outside of maybe Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan is an awful person, and Carter was too incompetent to matter. I dont know enough about Ford to pass judgement.

Your take on Biden is horrendous. The difference between him and trump is trump says bad things and Biden doesn't, but instead just does bad things. Most you would rather have a president that just hides his crime better and speaks more like a politician.

Ok.

[I_M4_AU 9,051]

25 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Biden and Trump are too f***ing old to be running for president in 2024.

Only thing I can agree on in your post.

26 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Making America great again is a completely different concept, based on who you ask and when you ask it. Ron DeSantis would make America really great again for straight white evangelicals at the expense of everyone else who isn't that.

And here lies the problem.  America is for everybody, if you believe in identity politics you really aren’t for America being great, you are for your particular view point being great.  Even though America is made up of individuals, to be a country the Constitution should be upheld at all costs.  Democrats want to tear down institutions like the SCOTUS, or at least modify those institutions, to forever bend the political winds to a more liberal view.

[I_M4_AU 9,051]

25 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Climb down off the cross.

It’s difficult when your are tied to your convictions and those convictions are attacked on a daily basis.  

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

17 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

And here lies the problem.  America is for everybody, if you believe in identity politics you really aren’t for America being great, you are for your particular view point being great.  Even though America is made up of individuals, to be a country the Constitution should be upheld at all costs.  Democrats want to tear down institutions like the SCOTUS, or at least modify those institutions, to forever bend the political winds to a more liberal view.

if you believe in identity politics you really aren’t for America being great

You really think Rin DeSantis doesn't believe in identity politics????

Democrats want to tear down institutions like the SCOTUS, or at least modify those institutions,

What do you mean?

 

[I_M4_AU 9,051]

28 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

if you believe in identity politics you really aren’t for America being great

You really think Rin DeSantis doesn't believe in identity politics????

Democrats want to tear down institutions like the SCOTUS, or at least modify those institutions,

What do you mean?

 

I believe Ron believes in a standard that is not being pushed by his Democratic opponents.  Family values and not succumbing to ideologies that want to change the way we look at history (CRT)

As for the SCOTUS, the Democrats have been all over wanting to impeach Clearance Thomas, assassinate Kavanaugh, protest the SCOTUS while they decide cases (Roe v Wade) and pack the court to take advantage of the current occupant of the White House.

That is not the way things should work, that is partisan politics, which both parties are guilty of.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

2 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I believe Ron believes in a standard that is not being pushed by his Democratic opponents.  Family values and not succumbing to ideologies that want to change the way we look at history (CRT)

As for the SCOTUS, the Democrats have been all over wanting to impeach Clearance Thomas, assassinate Kavanaugh, protest the SCOTUS while they decide cases (Roe v Wade) and pack the court to take advantage of the current occupant of the White House.

That is not the way things should work, that is partisan politics, which both parties are guilty of.

Family values? What families? These are all buzz terms that don't really have any meaning. 

You remember when the Republican's held Obama's right to appoint a supreme court justice for months in order to give it to someone who would appoint a conservative justice. That's a great example of the partisan politics you mentioned. 

The other stuff you mentioned, as it relates to the SCOTUS holds no weight, due to the fact that they haven't done any of that. 

But, I wish they would do more. The SCOTUS has changed its justice count before. At this point we have 6 conservative justices and 3 liberal justices representing a country that is made up of roughly half and half that voted overwhelmingly in favor of the more liberal presidential candidate. How is that fair and bipartisan representation of the country? 

And of course they protested Roe v Wade being overturned. It was the law of the land and wouldn't be changed, according to the conservative justices. The overturning is also MASSIVELY unpopular and not something that the majority of the country wanted. 

[I_M4_AU 9,051]

2 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Family values? What families? These are all buzz terms that don't really have any meaning. 

Of course it doesn’t to you.  Is valuing the future of society of no importance?

The fatherless in this country are the ones that create most of the crime.

6 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

That's a great example of the partisan politics you mentioned. 

Yes it is as I mentioned both parties are guilty of it.

7 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

The SCOTUS has changed its justice count before. At this point we have 6 conservative justices and 3 liberal justices representing a country that is made up of roughly half and half that voted overwhelmingly in favor of the more liberal presidential candidate. How is that fair and bipartisan representation of the country? 

The last time they changed the number was in 1869, so……. Believe it or not the SCOTUS is not a popularity contest.  It is there to judge on controversial rulings by lower courts as the Constitution as their guiding principle.  It really should not be judged by liberal and conservative judges, but it is.  It is divided between Constitutional originalist and the ones the believe the Constitution is a living document.

 

13 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

And of course they protested Roe v Wade being overturned.

It is illegal to protest at a Judges home on a case that is pending.  Again, not a popularity contest.  We now have states deciding what the abortion laws should be and that is what the law was before Roe v Wade.

[TitanTiger 21,558]

58 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Family values? What families? These are all buzz terms that don't really have any meaning. 

You remember when the Republican's held Obama's right to appoint a supreme court justice for months in order to give it to someone who would appoint a conservative justice. That's a great example of the partisan politics you mentioned. 

The other stuff you mentioned, as it relates to the SCOTUS holds no weight, due to the fact that they haven't done any of that. 

But, I wish they would do more. The SCOTUS has changed its justice count before. At this point we have 6 conservative justices and 3 liberal justices representing a country that is made up of roughly half and half that voted overwhelmingly in favor of the more liberal presidential candidate. How is that fair and bipartisan representation of the country? 

And of course they protested Roe v Wade being overturned. It was the law of the land and wouldn't be changed, according to the conservative justices. The overturning is also MASSIVELY unpopular and not something that the majority of the country wanted. 

Mitch McConnell holding up Merrick Garland even being voted on for 8 months before the elections was wrong and (as we saw with the Amy Coney Barrett nomination) utterly hypocritical.  This isn't even a question.  And I say that as someone who much prefers a justice like ACB on the court over Garland.

But that said, the issue of it being a 6-3 court while the electorate is fairly evenly split is something that happens frequently throughout history.  The court will always lag behind where the electorate happens to be because of lifetime terms, the timing of vacancies through death or retirement, and so on.  So I don't see the mere fact of a conservative advantage in this moment as evidence of something being wrong.  This kind of thing can and does happen even without the McConnell machinations.
 

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

10 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Mitch McConnell holding up Merrick Garland even being voted on for 8 months before the elections was wrong and (as we saw with the Amy Coney Barrett nomination) utterly hypocritical.  This isn't even a question.  And I say that as someone who much prefers a justice like ACB on the court over Garland.

But that said, the issue of it being a 6-3 court while the electorate is fairly evenly split is something that happens frequently throughout history.  The court will always lag behind where the electorate happens to be because of lifetime terms, the timing of vacancies through death or retirement, and so on.  So I don't see the mere fact of a conservative advantage in this moment as evidence of something being wrong.  This kind of thing can and does happen even without the McConnell machinations.
 

I agree with that. But the Republican's are pulling stunts like the Garland holdout and their supporters are crying about the fact that someone would even mention raising the number of justices. So basically the democrats have to play by the constitutional norms and the Republican's can just make the rules as they go. Doesn't seem very fair and bipartisan in my opinion. The SCOTUS is at the tilted level it is today, due to partisan hackery. 

It's not good enough to just call it wrong, after its done. The GOP doesn't give a sh*t about being called wrong. So the Democrats are well within their rights to play just as dirty to right the wrongs. And anyone who dares to call them partisan and also supports the GOP's stunts is a hypocritical hack.

We are also not dealing with a normal 6-3 conservative majority. They kicked off their tenure by making an extremally unpopular ruling that overturned the law that had been in place for years and protected millions.  

Edited June 27, 2023 by AuCivilEng1

[TitanTiger 21,558]

Just now, AuCivilEng1 said:

I agree with that. But the Republican's are pulling stunts like the Garland holdout and their supporters are crying about the fact that someone would even mention raising the number of justices. So basically the democrats have to play by the constitutional norms and the Republican's can just make the rules as they go. Doesn't seem very fair and bipartisan in my opinion. The SCOTUS is at the tilted level it is today, due to partisan hackery. 

Well, as they say, history doesn't repeat but it often rhymes.  In the 30s it was the Republicans playing by constitutional norms, but FDR didn't like that they kept voting down his New Deal programs so he announced a plan to expand the number of justices from 9 to 15 so he could nominate a slate of them who would back his policies.  It didn't end up happening because of a couple of favorable rulings that went his way, and because he served so long he was able to nominate enough replacements to tilt things in his favor.

I'm not saying Dems don't have a right to be mad about the Garland-to-Gorsuch deal.  But Republicans aren't wrong to point out the danger of just "expanding the court" any time things aren't going your way.  

[CoffeeTiger 5,957]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Only thing I can agree on in your post.

And here lies the problem.  America is for everybody, if you believe in identity politics you really aren’t for America being great, you are for your particular view point being great.

 

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

 Even though America is made up of individuals, to be a country the Constitution should be upheld at all costs.  Democrats want to tear down institutions like the SCOTUS, or at least modify those institutions, to forever bend the political winds to a more liberal view.

It's ironic you mention this in regards to Ron DeSantis considering how many of his political stunts in Florida are being ruled by courts to be unconstitutional and have been put on hold.  He's being sued by one of his states largest employer for violating their 1st amendment rights.  His abortion bans, his anti-wok bills, his anti-trans bills are all in appeals and have not taken affect because Federal judges have ruled they all violate the Constitution. To Ron DeSantis the Constitution is only a "guide" to be used and referenced when it suits and supports his beliefs and ignored when it doesn't. 

 

[I_M4_AU 9,051]

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

It's ironic you mention this in regards to Ron DeSantis considering how many of his political stunts in Florida are being ruled by courts to be unconstitutional and have been put on hold.  He's being sued by one of his states largest employer for violating their 1st amendment rights.  His abortion bans, his anti-wok bills, his anti-trans bills are all in appeals and have not taken affect because Federal judges have ruled they all violate the Constitution. To Ron DeSantis the Constitution is only a "guide" to be used and referenced when it suits and supports his beliefs and ignored when it doesn't. 

 

It is the way of the world, but I guess you haven’t caught up.  Law makers could care less what seems to be right now a days, they just do it and let the courts fight it out.  The best example of this is Biden’s attempt at dictatorship by using OSHA to issue a vaccine mandate.

[TexasTiger 14,524]

5 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

Well, as they say, history doesn't repeat but it often rhymes.  In the 30s it was the Republicans playing by constitutional norms, but FDR didn't like that they kept voting down his New Deal programs so he announced a plan to expand the number of justices from 9 to 15 so he could nominate a slate of them who would back his policies.  It didn't end up happening because of a couple of favorable rulings that went his way, and because he served so long he was able to nominate enough replacements to tilt things in his favor.

I'm not saying Dems don't have a right to be mad about the Garland-to-Gorsuch deal.  But Republicans aren't wrong to point out the danger of just "expanding the court" any time things aren't going your way.  

Difference is, today’s Republican Party would have done it anyhow if they could. It’s raw power if they can grab it.

I’ll add, the challenges FDR faced at that time were enormous. The economy had collapsed, people were destitute and fascism was on the rise.

[Mikey 16,781]

23 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

A ham sandwich would be a better president for America than Trump.

It would also be a much, much better president than Biden.

23 hours ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

I still haven't gotten a decent answer on why Trump would be a better president than Biden. Nothing that is supported by actual facts anyway.

Year over year inflation in Trump's last month, 1.4%.  Inflation currently, 5% (on top of 9% the prior year)

Real wages have decreased for 26 consecutive months under Biden. So much for Democrats being "the friend of the working class".

War on American energy. Biden approves Russia's Nordstrom pipeline and stops America's XL2 pipeline. Is he in Putin's pocket as well as communist China's?

The numbers on illegals entering this country are staggering. Biden's open border policy is as anti-American as something can get. Meanwhile, the steel to finish the wall that Trump wanted to build lies rusting in the desert. Biden won't even sell the materials to states so they can finish the wall.

The botched withdrawal from Afghanistan is an international embarrassment, which has emboldened Russia to invade the Ukraine and has China ready to attack Taiwan. They smell weakness and their assessment is accurate.

There is a lot more, but that should suffice.

23 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

of course you would vote for a crook.

No, I won't be voting for Biden. Mainly because the Communist Chinese have one of Biden's nuts in each hand. If he doesn't appease them they will squeeze and spill the beans about how "The Big Guy" got his cut of Sonny's extortion money. Perfect example: Letting China's spy balloon sail across the country and gather all the information they wanted before finally shooting it down AFTER it was back over the ocean and had transmitted everything back to China.

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

2 minutes ago, Mikey said:

It would also be a much, much better president than Biden.

Year over year inflation in Trump's last month, 1.4%.  Inflation currently, 5% (on top of 9% the prior year)

Real wages have decreased for 26 consecutive months under Biden. So much for Democrats being "the friend of the working class".

War on American energy. Biden approves Russia's Nordstrom pipeline and stops America's XL2 pipeline. Is he in Putin's pocket as well as communist China's?

The numbers on illegals entering this country are staggering. Biden's open border policy is as anti-American as something can get. Meanwhile, the steel to finish the wall that Trump wanted to build lies rusting in the desert. Biden won't even sell the materials to states so they can finish the wall.

The botched withdrawal from Afghanistan is an international embarrassment, which has emboldened Russia to invade the Ukraine and has China ready to attack Taiwan. They smell weakness and their assessment is accurate.

There is a lot more, but that should suffice.

No, I won't be voting for Biden. Mainly because the Communist Chinese have one of Biden's nuts in each hand. If he doesn't appease them they will squeeze and spill the beans about how "The Big Guy" got his cut of Sonny's extortion money. Perfect example: Letting China's spy balloon sail across the country and gather all the information they wanted before finally shooting it down AFTER it was back over the ocean and had transmitted everything back to China.

Year over year inflation in Trump's last month, 1.4%.  Inflation currently, 5% (on top of 9% the prior year)

Inflation was a global problem, and is coming down at a steady rate. It's almost like conservatives are in shock that a global pandemic that shut the entire world down would somehow affect the economy. Biden didnt exactly walk into a booming economic situation. The entire country was in the trash can.

Real wages have decreased for 26 consecutive months under Biden. So much for Democrats being "the friend of the working class".

Real wages have decreased due to inflation (inflation that has affected the entire world). The US has also added 10.7 million jobs and created a net 1.2 million jobs more that before he took office. But I guess job creation is only a thing you give credit for under a Republican, right?

War on American energy. Biden approves Russia's Nordstrom pipeline and stops America's XL2 pipeline. Is he in Putin's pocket as well as communist China's?

Crude oil production has increased over 4%. The inflation reduction act invested more money on clean energy infrastructure than ever seen in American history ($4.5 billion). I'd hardly call that a "war on energy". 

The numbers on illegals entering this country are staggering. Biden's open border policy is as anti-American as something can get. Meanwhile, the steel to finish the wall that Trump wanted to build lies rusting in the desert. Biden won't even sell the materials to states so they can finish the wall.

I don't have time to explain how wrong you are about the "open border policy". So here is a link to an article that explains how you're wrong and Biden is being just as awful to desperate people looking for a better life. I wish American would do a better job of creating programs that admit more people that want to come here and work hard. But every single president has flubbed up the border. 

https://www.cato.org/blog/bidens-border-policy-not-open-borders

The botched withdrawal from Afghanistan is an international embarrassment, which has emboldened Russia to invade the Ukraine and has China ready to attack Taiwan. They smell weakness and their assessment is accurate.

I served in Afghanistan and the whole conflict was a complete disaster. Good for his administration for having the courage to pull out. Also, 54% of U.S. adults say the decision to withdraw troops from the country was the right one, while 42% say it was wrong, according to a Pew Research Center survey. 

https://cv4a.org/the-overwatch/why-withdrawing-from-afghanistan-was-right-decision/

 

Most importantly than any of this, Biden doesn't sh*t his diapers and share classified military documents to anyone who is willing to give him attention. 

[KansasTiger 3,280]

55 minutes ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

Year over year inflation in Trump's last month, 1.4%.  Inflation currently, 5% (on top of 9% the prior year)

Inflation was a global problem, and is coming down at a steady rate. It's almost like conservatives are in shock that a global pandemic that shut the entire world down would somehow affect the economy. Biden didnt exactly walk into a booming economic situation. The entire country was in the trash can.

Real wages have decreased for 26 consecutive months under Biden. So much for Democrats being "the friend of the working class".

Real wages have decreased due to inflation (inflation that has affected the entire world). The US has also added 10.7 million jobs and created a net 1.2 million jobs more that before he took office. But I guess job creation is only a thing you give credit for under a Republican, right?

War on American energy. Biden approves Russia's Nordstrom pipeline and stops America's XL2 pipeline. Is he in Putin's pocket as well as communist China's?

Crude oil production has increased over 4%. The inflation reduction act invested more money on clean energy infrastructure than ever seen in American history ($4.5 billion). I'd hardly call that a "war on energy". 

The numbers on illegals entering this country are staggering. Biden's open border policy is as anti-American as something can get. Meanwhile, the steel to finish the wall that Trump wanted to build lies rusting in the desert. Biden won't even sell the materials to states so they can finish the wall.

I don't have time to explain how wrong you are about the "open border policy". So here is a link to an article that explains how you're wrong and Biden is being just as awful to desperate people looking for a better life. I wish American would do a better job of creating programs that admit more people that want to come here and work hard. But every single president has flubbed up the border. 

https://www.cato.org/blog/bidens-border-policy-not-open-borders

The botched withdrawal from Afghanistan is an international embarrassment, which has emboldened Russia to invade the Ukraine and has China ready to attack Taiwan. They smell weakness and their assessment is accurate.

I served in Afghanistan and the whole conflict was a complete disaster. Good for his administration for having the courage to pull out. Also, 54% of U.S. adults say the decision to withdraw troops from the country was the right one, while 42% say it was wrong, according to a Pew Research Center survey. 

https://cv4a.org/the-overwatch/why-withdrawing-from-afghanistan-was-right-decision/

 

Most importantly than any of this, Biden doesn't sh*t his diapers and share classified military documents to anyone who is willing to give him attention. 

I'm not gonna get into a whole thing. I agree we needed out of Afghanistan. I didn't serve there specifically, but spent some time at the Deid in Qatar. I dont count it as a deployment (theyd literally send army guys to R&R at the Deid), but I got to see alot of stuff up close and personal in the CAOC. 

So yes, good for finally pulling out (thats what she said?). How he did it was a disaster. Wish he had planned that better. It was wasteful, armed likely enemies, and created a massive power vacuum (maybe that last part was just inevitable).

And until you can prove to me otherwise, I believe they both Dookie their pants.

Edited June 28, 2023 by KansasTiger

[DKW 86 7,946]

On 6/27/2023 at 8:29 AM, TitanTiger said:

A ham sandwich would be a better president for America than Trump.

or the pick 100 names out of the phone book. 98 would be better than trump.

[Gowebb11 10,035]

9 hours ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

But every single president has flubbed up the border.

Amen. The border issue has been there for at least 40 years. The power and money for both parties is in the problem being there, not in finding a solution. 

9 hours ago, AuCivilEng1 said:

I served in Afghanistan and the whole conflict was a complete disaster. Good for his administration for having the courage to pull out. Also, 54% of U.S. adults say the decision to withdraw troops from the country was the right one, while 42% say it was wrong, according to a Pew Research Center survey. 

Thanks for your service. I have one question for those who think the withdrawal was wrong: We were there 20 years. What was going to be different in year 21 or 22 or 28?

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

Just now, Gowebb11 said:

Amen. The border issue has been there for at least 40 years. The power and money for both parties is in the problem being there, not in finding a solution. 

Thanks for your service. I have one question for those who think the withdrawal was wrong: We were there 20 years. What was going to be different in year 21 or 22 or 28?

You’re not supposed to ask that question. Lol

It wouldn’t have mattered when we pulled out or how long it took. 20 years in that country to do what we did has to be one of the biggest wastes of money and lives in history. 

[Gowebb11 10,035]

10 hours ago, Mikey said:

The numbers on illegals entering this country are staggering. Biden's open border policy is as anti-American as something can get. Meanwhile, the steel to finish the wall that Trump wanted to build lies rusting in the desert. Biden won't even sell the materials to states so they can finish the wall.

Trump took office with a majority in the house and senate and Republicans controlled 38 of 50 states. If ever the border situation could’ve been improved that was it. He was more concerned with mean tweeting than being President. Also, as I’ve said in another recent post, both parties use the border crisis as a political pawn. More power and money in having the problem than fixing it. It has been a mess for 40 years and neither party has fixed it  

 

[AuCivilEng1 12,539]

11 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

Trump took office with a majority in the house and senate and Republicans controlled 38 of 50 states. If ever the border situation could’ve been improved that was it. He was more concerned with mean tweeting than being President. Also, as I’ve said in another recent post, both parties use the border crisis as a political pawn. More power and money in having the problem than fixing it. It has been a mess for 40 years and neither party has fixed it  

 

I personally wish that more people would think about how awful it must be for people who have been born into such a awful horrible situation that they have to treck across the wilderness and attempt to illegally break into a country just for a chance to live a decent but still hard life.

Its become too easy for Americans to think of those people as some kind of parasites.

Edited June 28, 2023 by AuCivilEng1