Biblical Marriage

[PUB78 1,418]

On 5/20/2023 at 2:18 PM, homersapien said:

Yes it's myth.  Some of it is undoubtedly true, but the substantive stuff - like miracles - is myth.

The bible itself does not create harm. But a lot of people who believe it is the "word of God" certainly do.

Which miracles are myths or do you believe all of them in the Bible are?

[PUB78 1,418]

On 5/21/2023 at 11:24 AM, icanthearyou said:

I suppose.  That certainly explains why so many want God to be an authoritarian dictator.  They obviously have no real concept of right and wrong.  I suppose God becomes their only constraining force.  However, IMHO, if your motivations are not about love, justice, truth,,, you do not really know Jesus.

Still, regardless of religion, having no concern for the future, for those who will live in the future, is a basic failure of character and, shows a complete indifference towards humanity.

 

I agree with your 2nd paragraph.

[CoffeeTiger 5,953]

@Son of A Tiger how did you facepalm the same post 2 times? That’s cheating! 

[SaltyTiger 8,660]

8 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

@Son of A Tiger how did you facepalm the same post 2 times? That’s cheating! 

Fiddy did the same to me the other day. Glad ICHY does not have multiple facepalm powers.

[homersapien 12,307]

17 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

Of course you find it disturbing when you believe it is myth. 

If one can believe that as literal truth, one can believe ANYTHING.  Reality - like truth - ceases to exist.

That, to me, is worrisome, at least on a cultural and species level, if not individual.

Edited June 1, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 12,307]

10 hours ago, PUB78 said:

Which miracles are myths or do you believe all of them in the Bible are?

If a story defies the laws of nature, it's myth.  (That should be obvious.)

 

Edited June 1, 2023 by homersapien

[aubiefifty 18,443]

2 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

Fiddy did the same to me the other day. Glad ICHY does not have multiple facepalm powers.

be glad i do not tell your boys you drink bush lite and shop at target..............grins

[aubiefifty 18,443]

11 hours ago, PUB78 said:

Which miracles are myths or do you believe all of them in the Bible are?

well which do you believe there scooter? i am very curious..............

[SaltyTiger 8,660]

14 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

be glad i do not tell your boys you drink bush lite and shop at target..............grins

I still drink Ultra by AB. My boys have no problem with when I am buying.

[SaltyTiger 8,660]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

If a story defies the laws of nature, it's myth.  (That should be obvious.)

 

Stupid assessment. Not to bright are you? God created nature. He can manipulate the laws anyway he chooses. 

[homersapien 12,307]

58 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Stupid assessment. Not to bright are you? God created nature. He can manipulate the laws anyway he chooses. 

Yeah God also created man's cognitive reasoning ability, so if my disbelief in magic and fairy tales offends you - which it apparently does - tough s***.

Edited June 1, 2023 by homersapien

[Son of A Tiger 649]

11 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

@Son of A Tiger how did you facepalm the same post 2 times? That’s cheating! 

Beats me. I didn't even know I did. Wonder if it works on down votes. I wouldn't do it to you but there are a few here that I might😁

[TexasTiger 14,523]

3 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Beats me. I didn't even know I did. Wonder if it works on down votes. I wouldn't do it to you but there are a few here that I might😁

 

[Son of A Tiger 649]

58 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Yeah God also created man's cognitive reasoning ability, so if my disbelief in magic and fairy tales offends you - which it apparently does - tough s***.

You mean like the current myths surrounding climate control and global warming that you so adamantly defend?

[I_M4_AU 9,045]

5 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Beats me. I didn't even know I did. Wonder if it works on down votes. I wouldn't do it to you but there are a few here that I might😁

Considering the topic it must be a biblical miracle.

[Son of A Tiger 649]

2 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

 

Nah don't worry you aren't on the list......yet (LOL)

[homersapien 12,307]

10 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

You mean like the current myths surrounding climate control and global warming that you so adamantly defend?

You are insanely confused by equating biblical miracles with any proven scientific theory - much less anthropogenic global warming.  That's laughable.

(On a serious note, this is exactly why you people represent a danger to our society and our species.)

Edited June 1, 2023 by homersapien

[SaltyTiger 8,660]

9 hours ago, homersapien said:

Yeah God also created man's cognitive reasoning ability, so if my disbelief in magic and fairy tales offends you - which it apparently does - tough s***.

It does not offend me. Disappoint is a better word. Always respected your thought and intellect. You are stubborn and just do not get it do you?

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

On 5/29/2023 at 6:14 PM, Leftfield said:

On 5/19/2023 at 9:01 PM, NolaAuTiger said:

I have a corollary question. I know you’re a proponent of environmental action and you support combatting climate change. Are any of your beliefs in this regard (relative to the environment/climate change) undergirded by a concern for future generations? If so, then, as an atheist, why is it rational to view the world beyond your own life time? What value does the atheist see in sacrificial/costly action for the sake of future generations? 

Honest question: do you truly see atheists and agnostics in this light, i.e. rejecting a higher power due to self-interest? If so, I'm very surprised, but it also explains quite a bit if many share your view.

There is absolutely nothing illogical about attempting to better the world for future generations. Just because one does not believe in a higher power per se, that does not mean that one rejects anything greater than themselves. Children would be an obvious reason to do so, but even without, it's perfectly reasonable to expect a person to strive for the improvement and betterment of others. I actually think it's more irrational to not want that, as evolutionarily speaking it is detrimental to our survival in the first place.

All Nihilists are Atheists, but not all Atheists are Nihilists.

---------------------

@NolaAuTigerjust wanted to follow up on this, as I would genuinely like to know if the bolded part is accurate. If it is, it would help to understand where some people are coming from in discussions on this. Thanks.

 

I find an overarching inconsistency in the atheist worldview to consider future generations. The future in an atheist worldview is exceedingly short - to the end of his or her life on earth. The consistent message, then, is to maximize life, potential and opportunity now and fill those as quickly as possible. I see nothing consistent in this worldview to drive one to care about future generations. Costly sacrifice that yields no fruit in the present is contrary to the atheist worldview. 

[CoffeeTiger 5,953]

36 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

I find an overarching inconsistency in the atheist worldview to consider future generations. The future in an atheist worldview is exceedingly short - to the end of his or her life on earth. The consistent message, then, is to maximize life, potential and opportunity now and fill those as quickly as possible. I see nothing consistent in this worldview to drive one to care about future generations. Costly sacrifice that yields no fruit in the present is contrary to the atheist worldview. 

This isn't showing any kind of inconsistency. You're simply saying that 'you' personally can't understand why an atheist would choose to sacrifice for future generations or would choose to do anything in life that doesn't immediately benefit them personally. 

 

 

[Leftfield 3,417]

1 hour ago, NolaAuTiger said:

I find an overarching inconsistency in the atheist worldview to consider future generations. The future in an atheist worldview is exceedingly short - to the end of his or her life on earth. The consistent message, then, is to maximize life, potential and opportunity now and fill those as quickly as possible. I see nothing consistent in this worldview to drive one to care about future generations. Costly sacrifice that yields no fruit in the present is contrary to the atheist worldview. 

I personally have never seen the message you're referring to from atheists or agnostics, at least as a group. Certainly from individuals I've seen behavior that suggests that world view, but I've seen similar behavior from plenty of supposedly religious people as well. I think it's more a cross-section of who people are, rather than what they do or don't believe. If you want to be selfish you'll find a way to justify it, even if it's to the detriment of others.

As to sacrifice that gives no benefit now, I still don't understand why do you feel that atheists/agnostics have no logical motivation to do so. As mentioned, friends and family, particularly children, would be obvious reasons, but even failing that a person can strive to be part of something that is greater than themselves. The betterment of humanity and improving the world we live in is a perfectly logical goal. 

 

 

[homersapien 12,307]

14 hours ago, SaltyTiger said:

It does not offend me. Disappoint is a better word. Always respected your thought and intellect. You are stubborn and just do not get it do you?

No, I don't get it.  As I've joked many times here, I apparently didn't get the "God gene".  I have no need to believe in magic.

And if it doesn't offend you, what's with the insulting reaction?

"Stupid assessment. Not to bright are you? God created nature. He can manipulate the laws anyway he chooses." 

[homersapien 12,307]

2 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

I find an overarching inconsistency in the atheist worldview to consider future generations. The future in an atheist worldview is exceedingly short - to the end of his or her life on earth. The consistent message, then, is to maximize life, potential and opportunity now and fill those as quickly as possible. I see nothing consistent in this worldview to drive one to care about future generations. Costly sacrifice that yields no fruit in the present is contrary to the atheist worldview. 

That's a very transactional perspective. 

(Hardly surprising coming from a lawyer. )

I have personally observed just the opposite.  i have observed that many theists have a much more nihilistic worldview - literally apocalyptic - regarding our future.  The physical universe is practically irrelevant compared to eternity in heaven. Life is just an ordeal that must be endured first.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

1 hour ago, Leftfield said:

As to sacrifice that gives no benefit now, I still don't understand why do you feel that atheists/agnostics have no logical motivation to do so. As mentioned, friends and family, particularly children, would be obvious reasons, but even failing that a person can strive to be part of something that is greater than themselves. The betterment of humanity and improving the world we live in is a perfectly logical goal.

So the underlying motivation is simply empathy, i.e., I feel better that the future might be better? Is that the sole motivation? What else? 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

48 minutes ago, homersapien said:

That's a very transactional perspective. 

(Hardly surprising coming from a lawyer. )

I have personally observed just the opposite.  i have observed that many theists have a much more nihilistic worldview - literally apocalyptic - regarding our future.  The physical universe is practically irrelevant compared to eternity in heaven. Life is just an ordeal that must be endured first.

Quiet! The adults are talking.