Senate GOP blocks Equal Rights Amendment

[I_M4_AU 8,943]

40 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

apparently garbage.

Do you really believe this or don’t you know the answer?

Edited April 28, 2023 by I_M4_AU

[homersapien 12,244]

Congress holds the abortion hearing we have been waiting for

By Jennifer Rubin

 

Last week, I wrote a pointed column criticizing Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Richard J. Durbin (D-Ill.) and his fellow Democrats for not playing hardball with increasingly recalcitrant Republicans. I wrote that, while the committee held a hearing last summer on the legal ramifications of Dobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization, it hadn’t brought forward women and doctors to testify about the disastrous, real-world consequences of abortion bans that followed the overturning of Roe v. Wade.

On Wednesday, the committee held just such a hearing, inviting a Texas woman who nearly died because of her state’s abortion ban; an esteemed law professor; a practicing OB/GYN; a doctor from an antiabortion group; and a senior research associate from Notre Dame — a Catholic university.

The most compelling and heartbreaking testimony came from Amanda Zurawski, who lives in Texas. During her prepared remarks, she explained that after sending out invitations to her baby shower she began experiencing symptoms, her membranes ruptured, and she was “told by multiple doctors that the loss of our daughter was inevitable.” However, her doctors “didn’t feel safe enough to intervene as long as her heart was beating or until I was sick enough for the ethics board at the hospital to consider my life at risk and permit the standard health care I needed at that point — an abortion.”

Zurawski couldn’t very well drive to a “safe” state. (“Developing sepsis — which can kill quickly — in a car in the middle of the West Texas desert, or 30,000 feet above the ground, is a death sentence, and it’s not a choice we should have had to even consider.”) Instead, she had to wait — for either the fetus’s heart to stop or to get really sick. She nearly died from sepsis, which is why the standard of care in such circumstances is to perform an abortion before the woman gets very sick and risks death.

What happened was nothing short of horrifying:

In a matter of minutes, I went from being physically healthy to developing a raging fever and dangerously low blood pressure. My husband rushed me to the hospital where we soon learned I had developed sepsis — a condition in which bacteria in the blood develops into infection, with the ability to kill in under an hour. Several hours later, after stabilizing just enough to deliver our stillborn daughter, my vitals crashed again. In the middle of the night, I was rapidly transferred to the ICU, where I would stay for three days as medical professionals battled to save my life. I spent another three days in a less critical unit of the hospital — all because I was denied access to reasonable health care due to Texas’s new abortion bans.

If she had been alone or had lacked good medical care to rescue her, she would have died.

Not only did she suffer physical and mental trauma; she might not be able to have children in the future. As she put it, “The barbaric restrictions that are being passed across the country are having real life implications on real people.” She is now one of five women (in addition to two doctors) suing the state of Texas.

Her poignant denunciation of politicians who put her through this is worth listening to and watching in full: 

It’s a shame neither of her state’s senators, John Cornyn and Ted Cruz, both of whom are on the Judiciary Committee, bothered to be present to hear her.

The impact on doctors has also been horrific (which explains why more are avoiding states with abortion bans). Dr. Nisha Verma, a fellow for Physicians for Reproductive Health, explained in her prepared remarks, “Because of a law that is not based in medicine or science, I am forced to turn away patients that I know how to care for.” She continued, “I have had adolescents with chronic medical conditions that make their pregnancies very high-risk, women with irregular periods who don’t realize they are pregnant until after six weeks, and couples with highly desired pregnancies who receive a terrible diagnosis of a fetal anomaly, cry when they learn they can’t receive their abortion in our state, and beg me to help them.”

Contrary to the claptrap spread by the forced-birth crowd, Verma contended that “abortion is extremely safe and none of the arbitrary barriers imposed by politicians make it any safer.” A 2018 study by the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine confirmed “the safety record of abortion and pointed out that the biggest threat to patient safety is the litany of medically unnecessary regulations that raise costs and delay procedures, ultimately putting patients’ health at risk.”

Denying women abortions has grave consequences for women and their families. “Research shows that women who were denied abortion care are more likely to experience high blood pressure and other serious medical conditions during the end of pregnancy; more likely to remain in relationships where interpersonal violence is present; and more likely to experience poverty. Research also shows that states with higher numbers of abortion restrictions are the same states with poorer maternal health outcomes, with marginalized populations facing the largest burden,” Verma testified. Given that childbirth is 14 times more likely to result in death than abortion, the bans are endangering the lives of thousands of women.

The hearing was a welcome departure from the sometimes abstract, legalistic debates over abortion. The real-life consequences of the inhumane forced-birth law should be on full display for the entire country. Perhaps the Judiciary Committee will go on the road to hold more hearings and develop an accurate factual account of the barbarous and entirely predictable results flowing from Dobbs and abortion bans.

Even if the MAGA crowd cares not one whit about women (which was evident in Dobbs and the bans that followed), perhaps they will read the polls. The forced-birth position has proved to be a loser for Republicans. According to the latest PBS NewsHour-NPR-Marist poll, 59 percent oppose the Dobbs decision, the percentage of people favoring abortion access through six months has grown (up 20 points since 2009) and 70 percent say abortion in cases of rape and incest should be allowed throughout pregnancy.

A Pew Research Center survey shows, “Overall, around six-in-ten Americans say abortion should be legal in all (27%) or most (35%) cases, while 36% say it should be illegal in all (9%) or most (27%) cases.” Likewise, “around six-in-ten Americans (62%) say their greater concern is that some states are making it too difficult to get an abortion, while 35% say their greater concern is that some states are making it too easy to get an abortion.”

As more Americans learn about the victims of Dobbs and abortion bans, those numbers might shift even more in favor of allowing women to control their own bodies and make life-changing decisions for themselves.

It will be too late for victims such as Zurawski, but elections can have consequences and spare millions of women like her from a similar fate in the future.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/04/28/abortion-testimony-senate-zurawski/

Edited April 28, 2023 by homersapien

[aubiefifty 18,259]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Now, each state can decide what is legal in relation to abortion.  That is not a bad thing.  The late term up to birth is just wrong.

i agree with the late term. i would never abort any child i might have. ever. but no one should be able to tell a woman what she can do with her own body. that should be between her and god. do i care for it? no. but other than used as a tool for those enjoying sex abortions have saved thousands and thousands of lives over the years.for a party that claims to want less government yall are all up in other peoples business.

[I_M4_AU 8,943]

 

 

[arein0 1,105]

13 minutes ago, homersapien said:

It’s a shame neither of her state’s senators, John Cornyn and Ted Cruz, both of whom are on the Judiciary CommitIt’s a shame neither of her state’s senators, John Cornyn and Ted Cruz, both of whom are on the Judiciary Committee, bothered to be present to hear her.tee, bothered to be present to hear her.

Not surprising at all. Cruz likes to disappear during tragedies, such as when the Texas power grid failed a during the winter cold and he was off in Mexico.

[homersapien 12,244]

18 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

i agree with the late term. i would never abort any child i might have. ever. but no one should be able to tell a woman what she can do with her own body. that should be between her and god. do i care for it? no. but other than used as a tool for those enjoying sex abortions have saved thousands and thousands of lives over the years.for a party that claims to want less government yall are all up in other peoples business.

Roe allowed for second and third trimester abortions "contingent upon demonstrated threats to the pregnant mother’s health".   https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6457018/

While that maybe has the potential for more precise medical definition, it's an appropriate standard IMO.

[CoffeeTiger 5,881]

47 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

 

 

 

 

If that doctor doesn't know what negative effects pregnancy has and can have on a human body then she needs to go back to medical school.

https://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/maternalinfanthealth/pregnancy-complications.html

[I_M4_AU 8,943]

39 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

 

If that doctor doesn't know what negative effects pregnancy has and can have on a human body then she needs to go back to medical school.

https://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/maternalinfanthealth/pregnancy-complications.html

Contrary to liberal beliefs, pregnancy is not a disease.  Pregnancy is a natural event that can cause complications.  Those complications do need medical assistance.  Abortion is not a natural event, miscarriages occur naturally.  As Fifty has said it is up to the women and her God.

[wdefromtx 3,611]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

It’s a shame neither of her state’s senators, John Cornyn and Ted Cruz, both of whom are on the Judiciary Committee, bothered to be present to hear her.

Seems like her doctor's were more the issue than the law in place. The law clearly allows for abortions due to complications. 

[homersapien 12,244]

29 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

Seems like her doctor's were more the issue than the law in place. The law clearly allows for abortions due to complications. 

Apparently, it wasn't "clear" enough for her doctors.

[wdefromtx 3,611]

5 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Apparently, it wasn't "clear" enough for her doctors.

I have read it. If they can't figure it out she needs to rethink her doctors.

[homersapien 12,244]

19 hours ago, wdefromtx said:

I have read it. If they can't figure it out she needs to rethink her doctors.

I read it too.  How about quoting the "clear" part.

And her testimony was that she was "denied" an abortion.  It didn't say who denied it.  But if it was her doctor, I can see where finding another doctor to permit it would be problematic.

What doctor would approve of an abortion after it was previously denied by her original doctor?? 

That would be tantamount to asking for the state to arrest you.

 

Edited April 29, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 12,244]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/26/health/abortion-hearing-texas-senators-amanda-zurawski/index.html

....“Because I wasn’t permitted to have an abortion and the trauma and the PTSD and the depression that I have dealt with in the eight months since this happened to me is paralyzing,” she said. “On top of that, I am still struggling to have children.”

Zurawski told lawmakers Wednesday that she received an emergency abortion only after her condition worsened and she went into septic shock – adding that she may have been one of the first patients affected in the state of Texas after Roe was overturned, removing the federal right to an abortion.

“I wanted to address my senators Cruz and Cornyn, neither of whom regrettably are in the room right now, but I would like for them to know that what happened to me I think most people in this room would agree was horrific. But it’s a direct result of the policies that they support,” Zurawski said. “I nearly died on their watch, and furthermore, as a result of what happened to me, I may have been robbed of the opportunity to have children in the future.”

Zurawski is one of five women suing the state of Texas over its restrictive abortion laws, claiming they experienced pain and suffering because they were denied abortion care when they faced emergency complications in their pregnancies. The lawsuit was filed in March by the nonprofit Center for Reproductive Rights.

Zurawski previously told CNN she was denied abortion care after she had pregnancy complications. Eighteen weeks into her pregnancy, Zurawski’s water broke, which put her at high risk for a life-threatening infection. Zurawski’s baby, named Willow, was sure to die. Willow still had a heartbeat, and so doctors said that under Texas law, they were unable to terminate the pregnancy.

Texas at center of abortion battle

Texas, which has arguably the most aggressive abortion restrictions in the country, has been the site of several legal battles over abortion since before the Supreme Court overturned Roe v. Wade last June.

The language in Texas’ abortion laws is “incredibly vague, and it leaves doctors grappling with what they can and cannot do, what health care they can and cannot provide,” Zurawski said, bristling at the implication that her doctors were at fault for misinterpreting the state’s abortion bans. “And if they make the wrong the decision, they face up to 99 years in prison and/or losing their license.”

South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham, the top Republican on the committee, asked GOP witness Dr. Ingrid Skop, an obstetrician-gynecologist in Texas and vice president and director of medical affairs for the anti-abortion Charlotte Lozier Institute, to weigh in on what happened to Zurawksi.

“I am so sorry at your loss,” Skop said to Zurawski.

“And I am so sorry that your doctors misunderstood Texas law,” Skop said. “Every single law allows an exclusion for a doctor to use their reasonable medical judgment to determine when to intervene in a medical emergency, which is usually defined as a threat to the life of the mother or permanent irreversible damage to an organ or an organ system.”

Skop said that even before the Supreme Court reversed Roe, doctors were aware of how to assess medical emergencies where abortions should be offered and that the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology has in place guidance instructing providers to offer abortions or delivery for patients in Zurawski’s situation, acknowledging that the risk of infection is high, which can become life-threatening sepsis.

“Either one should have been offered and could have been offered to Amanda,” Skop said.

Cornyn, a Texas Republican who sits on the committee, later suggested that a medical malpractice lawsuit against her doctors is the legal route Zurawski should consider.

Later in the hearing, Zurawski said she wanted to respond to comments from Skop and Cornyn.

“Dr. Skop is not my physician. She has never been my physician. She has never treated me. She has not seen my medical records,” Zurawski said.

“Quite frankly, my physician and my team of health care professionals that I saw over the course of three days, while I was repeatedly turned away from health care access, made the decision to not provide an abortion because that’s what they felt they had to do under Texas’ law,” Zurawski said. “And that will continue to happen and it is continuing to happen, and it’s not a result of misinterpretation. It’s the result of confusion and the confusion is because the way the law is written.”

Edited April 28, 2023 by homersapien

[Mims44 2,004]

7 hours ago, arein0 said:

Where are you seeing that banning abortion is the will of the people? The last thing I saw was that Kentucky, Kansas, and Montana put it to a vote and failed to ban abortion, whereas Michigan, Vermont, and California successfully voted for pro choice. It is telling to me that the 3 that failed were deep red states, and the rest of the red states did not put it to a public vote after seeing the results from Kentucky, Kansas and Montana. 

Oh, then what are people complaining about?

I thought this thread was started because women had lost soooo many rights.

[arein0 1,105]

1 hour ago, Mims44 said:

Oh, then what are people complaining about?

I thought this thread was started because women had lost soooo many rights.

Basically after a couple of red states put abortion rights to a vote to try and show it was "the people's will" and failed, they decided to skip the vote and just ban it in their states without a vote. My point is that if it was "the people's will" restricting abortion rights should have won atleast 1 of the 6 that were put to a vote.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2022/11/09/abortion-election-results-kentucky-california-michigan-montana-vermont/8302538001/

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/06/24/1107126432/abortion-bans-supreme-court-roe-v-wade

Side note if you are interested in the "people's will" then W wouldn't have been elected in 2000 and Trump wouldn't have been elected in 2016. The last time before those 2 that a President was elected without winning the popular vote was in 1888.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

10 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

The bottom line is abortion is the leading cause of death in children.

That is a lie.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

3 hours ago, Mims44 said:

Oh, then what are people complaining about?

If this doesn't tell you that the poster has nothing serious to say,,, you can only pretend to be that stupid.

[I_M4_AU 8,943]

11 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

That is a lie.

You must be a tortured soul.

[aubiefifty 18,259]

19 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

 

 

women have medical issues every single day that result in them needing an abortion. this was not very well thought out iam.

[aubiefifty 18,259]

you guys shame yourselves the way you treat ichy. you laugh and make fun of him. you tell him crap about posting less. you twist his comments. and i would bet ichy posts with more love in his heart than probably any poster on this board. he wants those forgotten to be taken care of. he wants everyone to have a say. he apologizes when he is wrong and it is heartfelt but you guys ridicule him and throw him under the bus. Ichy is fighting for his country. in his country he wants everyone to do well. hell all you guys do is make the rich richer and too often spit in the face of those dealing with poverty. and you claim to be christian while doing it. this is why i take nothing from you guys. unless i am wrong. Ichy has not hurt a damn soul on this board. but you boys have fun with that.................

[I_M4_AU 8,943]

1 hour ago, aubiefifty said:

women have medical issues every single day that result in them needing an abortion. this was not very well thought out iam.

Yes, and a lot of those issues are it’s just not convenient to have this child now, maybe later.

[Mims44 2,004]

13 hours ago, icanthearyou said:

If this doesn't tell you that the poster has nothing serious to say,,, you can only pretend to be that stupid.

I'm sorry. I sincerely apologize for offending you.

Jesus will forgive you, but maybe try and reflect on what personally causes you to lash out so negatively towards people who are against murdering babies.

[homersapien 12,244]

About 10-15% of known pregnancies end in natural miscarriages, so - using the logic of the forced-birth crowd - the biggest cause of these "children's" deaths is God.

You heard it hear first folks, God is a murderer of children!

Edited April 29, 2023 by homersapien

[Mims44 2,004]

28 minutes ago, homersapien said:

About 10-15% of known pregnancies end in miscarriages, so - using the logic of the forced-birth crowd - the biggest cause of these "children's" deaths is God.

You heard it hear first folks, God is a murderer of children!

I don't know the point you're making?

According to lore God also once killed every man, woman, and child on Earth save 1 family. Cause people weren't doing what he wanted them to.

So God is a murderer of children, yeah.

But not just children. Everyone... the entire world population at one point (save Noah and his bunch)

 

Def didn't hear it here first  

[homersapien 12,244]

34 minutes ago, Mims44 said:

I don't know the point you're making?

According to lore God also once killed every man, woman, and child on Earth save 1 family. Cause people weren't doing what he wanted them to.

So God is a murderer of children, yeah.

But not just children. Everyone... the entire world population at one point (save Noah and his bunch)

 

Def didn't hear it here first  

The point I am making is that aborting a fertilized egg is not murder and will not incur the wrath of Jesus (as you clearly implied).

(Never mind the fact that imposing such religious beliefs on others using legislation is clearly unconstitutional.)