As Florida’s DeSantis roars ‘Onward, Christian soldiers!’ Democrats must get real about religion | Editorial

[aubiefifty 18,248]

As Florida’s DeSantis roars ‘Onward, Christian soldiers!’ Democrats must get real about religion | Editorial

•  

 

Al Diaz/adiaz@miamiherald.com

the Miami Herald Editorial Board

Sat, September 24, 2022 at 1:59 PM

 

 

In this article:

•  

 

 

•  

• 

  Ron DeSantis

  American politician

 

 

Is America a Christian nation?

The United States is a secular nation with no official religion, so the answer is No. But to Republicans such as Florida Gov. DeSantis, simplifying the answer to a Yes is a powerful tool. They’ve found a political gold mine in pitting Christians against the so-called evils of the left, gay and transgender people and teachers accused of pushing a “woke” agenda.

DeSantis’ flirting with Christian nationalism — the belief that America is in God’s plan and was intended to be a Christian nation — as the Herald recently reported, is not new in GOP politics. But it shows where the governor’s mind is. Elected in 2018 by a razor-thin margin in a state long considered purple — Florida has become redder, but it isn’t Mississippi, yet — he appears more concerned with 2024 GOP presidential primary voters. He’s not losing any sleep over alienating middle-of-the-road voters in his state.

But there’s something else to which the other side of the aisle should pay attention.

 

No coincidence

It doesn’t seem like a coincidence that, at the same time the GOP ramps up its rhetoric on religious and culture wars, the party makes gains with Hispanic and non-white voters in places like Miami-Dade.

That seems like a contradiction given that Donald Trump based his campaign on anti-immigrant and anti-”other” sentiment. But many of those groups share traditional values espoused by the GOP, religious values being one of them. When religious voters say they feel shamed for talking about God, they should not be derisively dismissed as Bible-thumpers.

Democrats have yet to come up with with an effective counter-narrative to DeSantis’ use of war imagery to talk about religion.

“Put on the full armor of God. Stand firm against the left’s schemes,” DeSantis told an audience at Michigan-based Christian Hillsdale College.

Yes, Democrats appear in some church pulpits to rally their base during election season, and high-profile politicians like President Biden, who’s Catholic, have been open about their faith. But given the onslaught of religious talk in Florida — and the use of government to promote one conservative religious view — Democrats must find a better way to acknowledge the importance of religion and spirituality in people’s lives without crossing the line into proselytizing.

If DeSantis is telling his followers to go fight to shape the nation to their religious liking, the counter-narrative should be that this rhetoric could not only incite violence, but it also undermines Christianity itself. For most Christians, religion doesn’t mean hostility toward your fellowmen and those who share different beliefs, as DeSantis makes it seem.

Religion has always been a sticky subject for the left. The Democratic Party has served as a big tent for Catholics, Protestants, religiously unaffiliated people, Jews, Muslims, voters of other religions, atheists and agnostics. While the GOP has been the party of mostly white Christians, Democrats “have been the party of everyone else,” and they can’t “hit the same note time and time again,” said Ryan Burge, an Eastern Illinois University professor who studies the intersection between religion and political behavior.

The appeal

The secularization of America presents challenges to DeSantis’ strategy in the long run. But, as Burge explained, Christian nationalism isn’t appealing only because of religion. To some, it’s nostalgia for the days when traditional values weren’t questioned, when “a woman was a woman and a man was a man,” to quote a common conservative grievance. It’s resistance in the face of the excesses of identity politics, which DeSantis skillfully mislabeled “woke” culture.

There’s a big difference between a leader turning to faith to guide their decisions and turning the state into the vehicle to advance one religious point of view. When the latter happens, the result is often to exclude people who don’t fit the mold. We cannot overlook the overlap between Christian nationalism — and its nostalgia for our “Anglo-Protestant” past — and white supremacy. Many devout Christians enslaved Black people in centuries past. This brings us to present-day data, cited in The New Yorker magazine, that, according to Robert P. Jones, head of the Public Religion Research Institute, a nonpartisan polling and research group, “The more racist attitudes a person holds, the more likely he or she is to identify as a white Christian.”

DeSantis and other conservative leaders are trying to erode the separation of church and state, a concept Thomas Jefferson wrote of in an 1802 letter and cited in landmark court rulings. Florida taxpayers are now paying for training sessions for public school teachers that deny the Founding Fathers wanted that separation. The Founding Fathers had very nuanced views about religion, as the Herald Editorial Board previously explained.

DeSantis is not alone in this. The majority-conservative U.S. Supreme Court chipped away at that wall of separation with a series of recent rulings. With Evangelicals proving to be such an important and faithful voting bloc for Trump, there’s incentive for our ambitious and savvy governor to continue to court them.

Whereas the governor’s Christian nationalist shtick only separates us, the Democrats need to counter it more boldly and bring back into their tent voters who feel that, on the issues of religion and faith, the party has nothing to say to them.

[I_M4_AU 8,940]

“We are in a fight for the soul of the nation”.  Joe Biden

I believe both sides believe this, except I’m not liking Biden’s vision of the soul of our nation.  Transing the kids, abortion on demand up until birth, open borders, defunding the police.  Not a good look.

[icanthearyou 4,468]

political grifting + religious grifting = ultimate grifting

Billy Graham and Jerry Falwell were ahead of their time.

[pensacolatiger 313]

All Dems want is for those pesky R’s to allow them to mutilate kids, kill the unborn, and continue w/ their unchecked human trafficking.  They don’t mean any harm……

[autigeremt 7,208]

The Democrats are scared of ole Ron. It’s starting to show. 

[PUB78 1,413]

10 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

As Florida’s DeSantis roars ‘Onward, Christian soldiers!’ Democrats must get real about religion | Editorial

 

•  

 

Al Diaz/adiaz@miamiherald.com

the Miami Herald Editorial Board

Sat, September 24, 2022 at 1:59 PM

 

 

In this article:

•  

 

 

•  

• 

  Ron DeSantis

  American politician

 

 

Is America a Christian nation?

The United States is a secular nation with no official religion, so the answer is No. But to Republicans such as Florida Gov. DeSantis, simplifying the answer to a Yes is a powerful tool. They’ve found a political gold mine in pitting Christians against the so-called evils of the left, gay and transgender people and teachers accused of pushing a “woke” agenda.

DeSantis’ flirting with Christian nationalism — the belief that America is in God’s plan and was intended to be a Christian nation — as the Herald recently reported, is not new in GOP politics. But it shows where the governor’s mind is. Elected in 2018 by a razor-thin margin in a state long considered purple — Florida has become redder, but it isn’t Mississippi, yet — he appears more concerned with 2024 GOP presidential primary voters. He’s not losing any sleep over alienating middle-of-the-road voters in his state.

But there’s something else to which the other side of the aisle should pay attention.

 

No coincidence

It doesn’t seem like a coincidence that, at the same time the GOP ramps up its rhetoric on religious and culture wars, the party makes gains with Hispanic and non-white voters in places like Miami-Dade.

That seems like a contradiction given that Donald Trump based his campaign on anti-immigrant and anti-”other” sentiment. But many of those groups share traditional values espoused by the GOP, religious values being one of them. When religious voters say they feel shamed for talking about God, they should not be derisively dismissed as Bible-thumpers.

Democrats have yet to come up with with an effective counter-narrative to DeSantis’ use of war imagery to talk about religion.

“Put on the full armor of God. Stand firm against the left’s schemes,” DeSantis told an audience at Michigan-based Christian Hillsdale College.

Yes, Democrats appear in some church pulpits to rally their base during election season, and high-profile politicians like President Biden, who’s Catholic, have been open about their faith. But given the onslaught of religious talk in Florida — and the use of government to promote one conservative religious view — Democrats must find a better way to acknowledge the importance of religion and spirituality in people’s lives without crossing the line into proselytizing.

If DeSantis is telling his followers to go fight to shape the nation to their religious liking, the counter-narrative should be that this rhetoric could not only incite violence, but it also undermines Christianity itself. For most Christians, religion doesn’t mean hostility toward your fellowmen and those who share different beliefs, as DeSantis makes it seem.

Religion has always been a sticky subject for the left. The Democratic Party has served as a big tent for Catholics, Protestants, religiously unaffiliated people, Jews, Muslims, voters of other religions, atheists and agnostics. While the GOP has been the party of mostly white Christians, Democrats “have been the party of everyone else,” and they can’t “hit the same note time and time again,” said Ryan Burge, an Eastern Illinois University professor who studies the intersection between religion and political behavior.

The appeal

The secularization of America presents challenges to DeSantis’ strategy in the long run. But, as Burge explained, Christian nationalism isn’t appealing only because of religion. To some, it’s nostalgia for the days when traditional values weren’t questioned, when “a woman was a woman and a man was a man,” to quote a common conservative grievance. It’s resistance in the face of the excesses of identity politics, which DeSantis skillfully mislabeled “woke” culture.

There’s a big difference between a leader turning to faith to guide their decisions and turning the state into the vehicle to advance one religious point of view. When the latter happens, the result is often to exclude people who don’t fit the mold. We cannot overlook the overlap between Christian nationalism — and its nostalgia for our “Anglo-Protestant” past — and white supremacy. Many devout Christians enslaved Black people in centuries past. This brings us to present-day data, cited in The New Yorker magazine, that, according to Robert P. Jones, head of the Public Religion Research Institute, a nonpartisan polling and research group, “The more racist attitudes a person holds, the more likely he or she is to identify as a white Christian.”

DeSantis and other conservative leaders are trying to erode the separation of church and state, a concept Thomas Jefferson wrote of in an 1802 letter and cited in landmark court rulings. Florida taxpayers are now paying for training sessions for public school teachers that deny the Founding Fathers wanted that separation. The Founding Fathers had very nuanced views about religion, as the Herald Editorial Board previously explained.

DeSantis is not alone in this. The majority-conservative U.S. Supreme Court chipped away at that wall of separation with a series of recent rulings. With Evangelicals proving to be such an important and faithful voting bloc for Trump, there’s incentive for our ambitious and savvy governor to continue to court them.

Whereas the governor’s Christian nationalist shtick only separates us, the Democrats need to counter it more boldly and bring back into their tent voters who feel that, on the issues of religion and faith, the party has nothing to say to them.

Godlessness and Big Government are the religions of the Democrats.

[arein0 1,105]

1 hour ago, PUB78 said:

Godlessness and Big Government are the religions of the Democrats.

I think its ironic the Republicans are all for personal freedoms, but their platform right now is restricting womens rights and restricting religious freedom for non Christians. I am a Christian, but I dont believe that our country should be forcing people to be a Christian. It should be a personal choice.

[ShocksMyBrain 9,668]

1 hour ago, PUB78 said:

Godlessness and Big Government are the religions of the Democrats.

Such irony. 

[aubiefifty 18,248]

not one person among the right said it sucks on sending the worst and the rapists to another community. but then trump was widely excepted and still is you guys are just not vocal about it. so lets see. trump lost the election really! jan 6 was just a minor protest. trump is the best pres we have ever had. now you guys are trying like hell to turn christianity into something evil.by far folks on the right are shooting up schools and churches and bars and just where ever they can

[aubiefifty 18,248]

9 hours ago, autigeremt said:

The Democrats are scared of ole Ron. It’s starting to show. 

no we do not want another trump in office to screw things up worse.

[SaltyTiger 8,575]

20 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

separation of church and state, a concept Thomas Jefferson wrote of in an 1802 letter and cited in landmark court rulings.

Hard to believe a concept from a slave owner is acceptable.

[I_M4_AU 8,940]

8 hours ago, arein0 said:

I think its ironic the Republicans are all for personal freedoms, but their platform right now is restricting womens rights and restricting religious freedom for non Christians. I am a Christian, but I dont believe that our country should be forcing people to be a Christian. It should be a personal choice.

Please explain just how our country is forcing people to be Christian.  They are forcing children to study gender identity at 5 years old though. 

[arein0 1,105]

28 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Please explain just how our country is forcing people to be Christian.  They are forcing children to study gender identity at 5 years old though. 

I said platform. There are several Republicans that have openly stated that the country should remove separation of church and state and that we should be a Christian Country. This opens up the ability to teach Christianity in public schools (forcing religion), which those same Republicans have said needs to happen.

How would you feel if instead of Christianity, let's say a big group of people were making a serious push to have Hinduism or Muslim as the National Religion, and are also pushing to have their religion taught at public schools?

Hypothetical question: Let's say we do proceed and become a Christian Country, what is stopping the Country from prosecuting non Christians for not following the National Religion?

As for your second point. I agree, I dont think it is right to teach gender identity at 5.

[I_M4_AU 8,940]

1 hour ago, arein0 said:

I said platform. There are several Republicans that have openly stated that the country should remove separation of church and state and that we should be a Christian Country. This opens up the ability to teach Christianity in public schools (forcing religion), which those same Republicans have said needs to happen.

How would you feel if instead of Christianity, let's say a big group of people were making a serious push to have Hinduism or Muslim as the National Religion, and are also pushing to have their religion taught at public schools?

Hypothetical question: Let's say we do proceed and become a Christian Country, what is stopping the Country from prosecuting non Christians for not following the National Religion?

As for your second point. I agree, I dont think it is right to teach gender identity at 5.

Do you really think the separation of church and state is going away?  I wonder why the Republicans would say such a thing?

A pro-life activist was arrested at his home Friday during an FBI raid on charges that he assaulted an abortion clinic volunteer in Philadelphia last year.

More than two dozen FBI agents came to arrest Mark Houck shortly after 7 a.m., according to Mr. Houck’s wife Ryan-Marie, who spoke with pro-life news outlet LifeSiteNews.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/sep/25/pro-life-activist-arrested-during-fbi-raid-pennsyl/

You probably didn’t see this as it was not important enough for the MSM to be bothered with.  Biden’s government has an all out assault on the private citizen especially if they are Trump supporters and say anything Christian.  Case in point:

MyPillow CEO Mike Lindell, a supporter of Donald Trump who has espoused the former president's false claims that the 2020 election was stolen, said he was served a federal subpoenaTuesday and that his phone was seized by federal agents.

Lindell claimed in a video posted online Tuesday that FBI agents approached him after he ordered food at a Hardee's drive-thru in Mankato, Minnesota. Patrick McSweeney, an attorney for Lindell, confirmed in an email to CBS News that the subpoena was served and Lindell's cell phone was confiscated.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mike-lindell-phone-seized-by-fbi-mypillow/

It has been rumored the FBI has had the best nights sleep ever since the raid.  That is unconfirmed however.

I think it is political rhetoric to show the stark differences in philosophy of each political party.  Listening to Lauren Boebert is like listening to AOC, two peas in a pod on the opposite side of the spectrum.

[Leftfield 3,376]

12 hours ago, PUB78 said:

Godlessness and Big Government are the religions of the Democrats.

@SaltyTiger, this is the type of thing I was referring to.

[pensacolatiger 313]

4 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

not one person among the right said it sucks on sending the worst and the rapists to another community. but then trump was widely excepted and still is you guys are just not vocal about it. so lets see. trump lost the election really! jan 6 was just a minor protest. trump is the best pres we have ever had. now you guys are trying like hell to turn christianity into something evil.by far folks on the right are shooting up schools and churches and bars and just where ever they can

Wrong thread amigo - you’re letting your media induced hatred of Christians cloud your thinking 

[pensacolatiger 313]

1 hour ago, Leftfield said:

@SaltyTiger, this is the type of thing I was referring to.

Well they do enjoy genocide, mutilation, human trafficking, and don’t forget they need MOAR WAR in Ukraine

[aubiefifty 18,248]

2 minutes ago, pensacolatiger said:

Wrong thread amigo - you’re letting your media induced hatred of Christians cloud your thinking 

you people sling the word hatred around like you guys use it a lot. show me where i said i hated anyone on here. and you assume a lot but you do not know jack about me. i am a struggling christian i jut hate what they do. at the same time i feel i am not worthy to call myself a christian but i hope to get there.

[pensacolatiger 313]

1 minute ago, aubiefifty said:

you people sling the word hatred around like you guys use it a lot. show me where i said i hated anyone on here. and you assume a lot but you do not know jack about me. i am a struggling christian i jut hate what they do. at the same time i feel i am not worthy to call myself a christian but i hope to get there.

Brother we (Christians) are all struggling Christians.  Jesus is the only answer.  There’s monumental external pressure to “get in line” with so many things that are unGodly.  Murder, slavery (trafficking), lawlessness.  Not dictating anything political to you right now, but would recommend taking a biblical view of the world.  And the less views you have that oppose the Bible, the more peace you’ll have

[icanthearyou 4,468]

26 minutes ago, pensacolatiger said:

Brother we (Christians) are all struggling Christians.  Jesus is the only answer.  There’s monumental external pressure to “get in line” with so many things that are unGodly.  Murder, slavery (trafficking), lawlessness.  Not dictating anything political to you right now, but would recommend taking a biblical view of the world.  And the less views you have that oppose the Bible, the more peace you’ll have

If you replace the word bible with the name of Jesus,,, I would agree.  Without Jesus in your heart,,, the bible in your head means very little.

[pensacolatiger 313]

5 minutes ago, icanthearyou said:

If you replace the word bible with the name of Jesus,,, I would agree.  Without Jesus in your heart,,, the bible in your head means very little.

We agree on something😁

[PUB78 1,413]

19 hours ago, arein0 said:

I think its ironic the Republicans are all for personal freedoms, but their platform right now is restricting womens rights and restricting religious freedom for non Christians. I am a Christian, but I dont believe that our country should be forcing people to be a Christian. It should be a personal choice.

I agree with your last two sentences.

[1716AU 791]

On 9/26/2022 at 12:31 PM, I_M4_AU said:

“We are in a fight for the soul of the nation”.  Joe Biden

I believe both sides believe this, except I’m not liking Biden’s vision of the soul of our nation.  Transing the kids, abortion on demand up until birth, open borders, defunding the police.  Not a good look.

Neither is willful ignorance, but you're doing your best

[CoffeeTiger 5,876]

https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/2022/09/27/gadsden-county-commissioner-resigns-after-kkk-photo-emerges-jeffery-moore-gov-ron-desantis-florida/8119165001/

Gadsden County commissioner appointed by Gov. DeSantis resigns after KKK costume photo emerges

 

 

Dang cancel culture at it again. We're to a point where red blooded, Conservative Southerners cant even go outside in their KKK robes anymore without it turning into a scandal. SMH

[I_M4_AU 8,940]

57 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/2022/09/27/gadsden-county-commissioner-resigns-after-kkk-photo-emerges-jeffery-moore-gov-ron-desantis-florida/8119165001/

Gadsden County commissioner appointed by Gov. DeSantis resigns after KKK costume photo emerges

 

 

Dang cancel culture at it again. We're to a point where red blooded, Conservative Southerners cant even go outside in their KKK robes anymore without it turning into a scandal. SMH

If he was only the Governor of Virginia he would have been forgiven.