Harsin calling plays, more fast tempo

[Tiger Refuge 6,782]

1 hour ago, bigbird said:

Well, they both use helmets, cleats, chin straps, and...

Don’t forget a football. Oh, and players.

[AU9377 6,033]

20 hours ago, kennypowers said:

Don't focus too much on the play calling comparison (no matter how small the similarities), but focus on the culture he is installing here.  It's a culture we need...it's a culture Auburn should be.  Hard work...no primadonna attitudes.  Harsin cares more about work ethic and getting these guys to the NFL than he does playing the fun/funny/attitude players.  Hard work and effort on every play.  Seen too many entitled attitudes the last few years...

Yes, this is said EVERY time that a new staff is hired.  Without fail.

[Gowebb11 9,872]

10 minutes ago, AU9377 said:

Yes, this is said EVERY time that a new staff is hired.  Without fail.

Generally speaking, yes. But Chizik brought a 5-19 HC record with him, and Gus brought one year of HC experience. CBH brought a 69-19 record, some conference championships, a Fiesta Bowl win, and had developed some guys for the NFL. His culture building resume is much better so there’s more reason to believe in it. 

[slyinsocal 831]

On 12/21/2021 at 3:55 PM, AU-24 said:

https://auburn.rivals.com/news/bryan-harsin-brings-a-different-tempo-to-offense-auburn-tigers-football

Article states Harsin has always had his hand on the O. Harsin wants more of a fast-paced tempo, Harsin will call the plays.
 

Sounds allot like somebody else we know…

The bigger playbook (Harsin) > the smaller playbook (somebody else we know)....

[japantiger 4,118]

While I am glad to see Harsin now saying he wants to go with "tempo"; why has it taken him 12 games to actually install it over 2 days of bowl practice?  I guess better late than never, but I have to question where he was all season long to just now come to this conclusion.  It was painfully obvious that we needed to do that from the beginning of the season; I called it out around the time of the PSU game; we had too many weaknesses that needed to be mitigated and one easy/effective way to do that is with "tempo".  Especially as the OL and WR group needed to develop so much...I called that out on here and was roundly criticized by so many 'experts".  The bigger issue to me is as HC, I have to question Harsin's "involvement" and direct leadership.  If his OC couldn't/didn't want to do it; hell, he should have fired him before he fired the WR coach.  If he knew he needed to do it (which anyone could see) and didn't because of his OC; that's on him; not the OC.  Every subordinate needs managing and they sometimes have to be told to "get onboard and comply"; and if you need help, you tell them to ask for it..  

We had an inferior OL and WR group that needed to learn the game and 2 QB's that we needed to find ways to mitigate their weaknesses rather than playing to them.  Putting the QB on a pitch count, leaning on the running game (our strength) and going tempo was an obvious way to minimize the other guys ability to scheme for everything you do...you get the D in a favorable scheme and then run tempo to prevent them from adjusting into different down/distance/personnel packages and play you with their base defense.  It is not a panacea in the face of far superior talent; but frankly looking back; only the GA game could be considered a blowout.  This should have been done from the beginning.

[e808 3,091]

Unpopular opinion again. He is more like the previous coach than different based on the first year. However this could change. The examples are poor in game decision making, oline recruiting lacking, firing coaches and  repetitive on coach speak. We had a good week of practice has been replaced with we will look at the tape and learn from it. Again solely based on this years body of work

[Didba 5,510]

4 minutes ago, e808 said:

Unpopular opinion again. He is more like the previous coach than different based on the first year. However this could change. The examples are poor in game decision making, oline recruiting lacking, firing coaches and  repetitive on coach speak. We had a good week of practice has been replaced with we will look at the tape and learn from it. Again solely based on this years body of work

Sometimes, something is a unpopular opinion because its not a very fact based opinion... like the one you just stated.  Your 2nd, 3rd, and 4th examples are lacking in supporting facts.  I could easily point out why they are bad examples, and how Harsin is different from Gus on those three fronts but I am running to the store with the wife, maybe I'll write them up for you when I get back if someone else hasn't addressed it by then.

[Carnell 600]

Talking about uptempo is far easier than implementing it.  I guess people on this board figure SEC DCs won't try confuse our QB with a lot of presnap reads and disguise coverages to slow our QB decision making process.  I will be willing to bet a couple of ints in that uptempo will slow it down.

[DAG 34,763]

2 hours ago, japantiger said:

While I am glad to see Harsin now saying he wants to go with "tempo"; why has it taken him 12 games to actually install it over 2 days of bowl practice?  I guess better late than never, but I have to question where he was all season long to just now come to this conclusion.  It was painfully obvious that we needed to do that from the beginning of the season; I called it out around the time of the PSU game; we had too many weaknesses that needed to be mitigated and one easy/effective way to do that is with "tempo".  Especially as the OL and WR group needed to develop so much...I called that out on here and was roundly criticized by so many 'experts".  The bigger issue to me is as HC, I have to question Harsin's "involvement" and direct leadership.  If his OC couldn't/didn't want to do it; hell, he should have fired him before he fired the WR coach.  If he knew he needed to do it (which anyone could see) and didn't because of his OC; that's on him; not the OC.  Every subordinate needs managing and they sometimes have to be told to "get onboard and comply"; and if you need help, you tell them to ask for it..  

We had an inferior OL and WR group that needed to learn the game and 2 QB's that we needed to find ways to mitigate their weaknesses rather than playing to them.  Putting the QB on a pitch count, leaning on the running game (our strength) and going tempo was an obvious way to minimize the other guys ability to scheme for everything you do...you get the D in a favorable scheme and then run tempo to prevent them from adjusting into different down/distance/personnel packages and play you with their base defense.  It is not a panacea in the face of far superior talent; but frankly looking back; only the GA game could be considered a blowout.  This should have been done from the beginning.

I am thinking he wanted to give Bobo the benefit of a doubt but now he sees he can’t play that game. That is how you get fired. Now he is completely taking control of the reigns and doing it his way. Why he didn’t do this at the start? Probably because we always have people in the background with their hands in the cookie jar. 

[Hank2020 3,357]

19 minutes ago, DAG said:

I am thinking he wanted to give Bobo the benefit of a doubt but now he sees he can’t play that game. That is how you get fired. Now he is completely taking control of the reigns and doing it his way. Why he didn’t do this at the start? Probably because we always have people in the background with their hands in the cookie jar. 

It may have been an up front agreement between Harsin/Bobo at the hiring. Bobo knew Harsin’s OC backround.

[autiger88 3,856]

23 minutes ago, DAG said:

I am thinking he wanted to give Bobo the benefit of a doubt but now he sees he can’t play that game. That is how you get fired. Now he is completely taking control of the reigns and doing it his way. Why he didn’t do this at the start? Probably because we always have people in the background with their hands in the cookie jar. 

👀

[e808 3,091]

1 hour ago, Didba said:

Sometimes, something is a unpopular opinion because its not a very fact based opinion... like the one you just stated.  Your 2nd, 3rd, and 4th examples are lacking in supporting facts.  I could easily point out why they are bad examples, and how Harsin is different from Gus on those three fronts but I am running to the store with the wife, maybe I'll write them up for you when I get back if someone else hasn't addressed it by then.

Of course u can dress it up to fit what ever narrative u won’t but both dumped coaches because of feeling the pressure. The former coach and current coach both have repetitive lines in pressers but yield the same results. 
 

I still believed corn got fired for know reason. The receivers improved as the season went on because of reps and experience.

Edited December 23, 2021 by e808

[Didba 5,510]

2 hours ago, e808 said:

Of course u can dress it up to fit what ever narrative u won’t but both dumped coaches because of feeling the pressure. The former coach and current coach both have repetitive lines in pressers but yield the same results. 
 

I still believed corn got fired for know reason. The receivers improved as the season went on because of reps and experience.

LMAO, some of y'all crack me up. I could refute everything in this post but its not worth my times especially when it will fall on deaf ears.

[e808 3,091]

9 minutes ago, Didba said:

LMAO, some of y'all crack me up. I could refute everything in this post but its not worth my times especially when it will fall on deaf ears.

Go for it . I won’t all the smoke. It won’t change my opinion all those things happen d U just gonna spin it and try to add a reason why they are different. Like someone said this is a message board every post doesn’t need to be dissecting like this is dragnet or a court of law. People can have opinions and different perspective that’s what makes America great

[Didba 5,510]

4 minutes ago, e808 said:

Go for it . I won’t all the smoke. It won’t change my opinion all those things happen d U just gonna spin it and try to add a reason why they are different. Like someone said this is a message board every post doesn’t need to be dissecting like this is dragnet or a court of law. People can have opinions and different perspective that’s what makes America great

Nothing I post on here is "spin".

[au302 2,669]

Everyone tune into ESPN right now. Still early, but I am having PTSD. 3rd and long and no passes more than 5 yards. Despite the growing pains and Bobo, I have been reminded on just how much better this offense is

[aucanucktiger 1,891]

2013:

"Malzahn calling the plays and they're more up tempo".😉🤣

[japantiger 4,118]

16 hours ago, Hank2020 said:

It may have been an up front agreement between Harsin/Bobo at the hiring. Bobo knew Harsin’s OC backround.

Dag and Hank, you both could be right...telling someone it is their job to run,though, is not the same as saying do the opposite of "our" vision for the offense.  Of course, maybe they never agreed on the vision...again if that is the case then Harsin made a huge mistake.   This is really the 1st aspect of Harsin's tenure that looks like a pretty basic rookie mistake.  For a guy that had run a program as long as he had, not sure why he would go away from a very basic leadership tenant like that.  I can only assume he and Davis will have a stronger alignment on expectations.  

[Mims44 2,004]

18 hours ago, Didba said:

Sometimes, something is a unpopular opinion because its not a very fact based opinion... like the one you just stated.  Your 2nd, 3rd, and 4th examples are lacking in supporting facts.  I could easily point out why they are bad examples, and how Harsin is different from Gus on those three fronts but I am running to the store with the wife, maybe I'll write them up for you when I get back if someone else hasn't addressed it by then.

 

14 hours ago, Didba said:

LMAO, some of y'all crack me up. I could refute everything in this post but its not worth my times especially when it will fall on deaf ears.

 

14 hours ago, Didba said:

Nothing I post on here is "spin".

I no joke love these type posts, started doing them myself.

 

 

Everything you've said is false and I can easily disprove it all. But ... uhhhh, see my wifes at the store, and I just... uhh, don't feel like it.

 

[DAG 34,763]

55 minutes ago, japantiger said:

Dag and Hank, you both could be right...telling someone it is their job to run,though, is not the same as saying do the opposite of "our" vision for the offense.  Of course, maybe they never agreed on the vision...again if that is the case then Harsin made a huge mistake.   This is really the 1st aspect of Harsin's tenure that looks like a pretty basic rookie mistake.  For a guy that had run a program as long as he had, not sure why he would go away from a very basic leadership tenant like that.  I can only assume he and Davis will have a stronger alignment on expectations.  

I believe the hard truth is unless you are a NS or Jimbo, you have to play the game. It is true , it was a clear mistake that cost us wins in my opinion. Let’s hope he has learnt from it. We cannot afford anymore rookie mistakes 

[au302 2,669]

A question I've been curious about. Did the offense this year resemble a traditional Bobo offense, Boise offense, a mix? Maybe more Gus elements in there since we had to adapt to our personnel. To my untrained eye, it seemed like a lot of Bobo. I'm assuming that we'll drop that stuff and go full Boise by the fall

[Hank2020 3,357]

3 hours ago, DAG said:

I believe the hard truth is unless you are a NS or Jimbo, you have to play the game. It is true , it was a clear mistake that cost us wins in my opinion. Let’s hope he has learnt from it. We cannot afford anymore rookie mistakes 

Everybody makes mistakes in coaching (no matter who you are). They make too many spontaneous decisions not to make some.

[homersapien 12,239]

On 12/22/2021 at 7:55 AM, ThurstontheWelshCorgi said:

I pretty much roll my eyes when I hear anything about tempo.. Ever since Saban freaked out and pushed so hard to change the rules the whole tempo stuff has been less than what it once was.

 

 

UCF used it pretty effectively a couple of times yesterday.  The other times they didn't execute.

Edited December 24, 2021 by homersapien

[homersapien 12,239]

I wonder who made the decision not to go for 2 - and the win - after our first overtime touchdown, Harsin or Bobo? 

Why would we prefer to get into a long overtime shootout with a gassed defense against a team with far more depth? And apparently we had the perfect 2 point play in our bag, since we ran it successfully in the 3rd overtime.

Course, this is all hindsight, but that seems like situation in which Harsin should have intervened (assuming he didn't agree).  IMO, we should have gone for the win asap given the opportunity.

We should have won that game.

[japantiger 4,118]

3 hours ago, Hank2020 said:

Everybody makes mistakes in coaching (no matter who you are). They make too many spontaneous decisions not to make some.

This was not a mistake due a spontaneous decisions that had to be made in the middle of a game. This was being aligned on basic offense philosophy between the head guy and the guy charged with implementing it.   This decision was/wasn't made in the quiet of the office.  That's my issue.  Given our limitations, there were some obvious moves that should have been made to mitigate them and focus on what we could do well.   

But, I see no reason to not criticize game decisions either when they are pretty obvious...in our case, they went hand in hand with poor game planning recognizing the talent we had (or didn't have).  As Homey points out; with a lame QB and a gassed defense, you don't extend that game...you have the opportunity to go for it on one play (and you have a really, really good play) and Alabama doesn't get another chance to extend the game and use their superior talent and depth.  You've got to make a quick decision, sure; but my wife called the right move on that play real time while we were watching the game.  Not sure why guys who get paid well to make that decision can't see the same thing my family saw as we watched it.  The staff ignored the obvious limitations of our talent in key situations/plays on multiple occasions (like PSU) and in the bigger picture of overall game planning...if Bobo was the cause, then he should be gone...but I don't understand why a leader (Harsin) would let that crap go on for 12 games.