letting a magical season slip away

[nixtosanders94 2,180]

53 minutes ago, kwagoner said:

Not being critical, but I think wishing for better is about all you can do. I don’t realistically see a top tier coach wanting to come here until a period of steady period of drama free coach/fan/BOT/AD relationships exist. Be it jet-gate, constant buy-out talk, highest donor having the say, puppet AD, blah blah blah this isn’t a good environment to coach. Granted the benefit of failure is great (are we still paying the past 3 coaches?) and that too is evidence of a less than ideal environment. We’ve bled ourselves on gambles (Chizik/Malzahn) so imagine what kind of contract we’d have to offer a proven top tier coach, and the uproar when he fails to live up to the standards that would come with it. Heck, even those in love with Smart (which I am not) remember how he declined because of the lack of willingness to change from the old Auburn ways. 

Much of our culture needs to change before fans can realistically expect to contend for top coaches.

 

edit-  ** I do believe that AD Greene is a step in the right direction**

Yeah you’re right.  We should give up. Good call. Why even have a football program? 

Solid point. Good post.

[Cardin Drake 2,076]

If Bama beats LSU,  LSU with one loss goes before we do.  And they won't take 3 SEC schools.  Our only chance really is for LSU to beat Bama, and we win out.  Then we would be the 2nd SEC team. But even in that scenario, they probably would not take a 2 loss team, and the SEC would only get one.  It would depend on a lot of other factors in other conferences.  OU losing a conference championship game, for instance.  We seriously need an 8 team playoff with our schedule.

 

[nixtosanders94 2,180]

58 minutes ago, kwagoner said:

Not being critical, but I think wishing for better is about all you can do. I don’t realistically see a top tier coach wanting to come here until a period of steady period of drama free coach/fan/BOT/AD relationships exist. Be it jet-gate, constant buy-out talk, highest donor having the say, puppet AD, blah blah blah this isn’t a good environment to coach. Granted the benefit of failure is great (are we still paying the past 3 coaches?) and that too is evidence of a less than ideal environment. We’ve bled ourselves on gambles (Chizik/Malzahn) so imagine what kind of contract we’d have to offer a proven top tier coach, and the uproar when he fails to live up to the standards that would come with it. Heck, even those in love with Smart (which I am not) remember how he declined because of the lack of willingness to change from the old Auburn ways. 

Much of our culture needs to change before fans can realistically expect to contend for top coaches.

 

edit-  ** I do believe that AD Greene is a step in the right direction**

If you’re waiting on a steady period of drama free Auburn...well, I’ll see you in about 1 billion years when the sun goes supernova. 

[kwagoner 214]

9 minutes ago, nixtosanders94 said:

Yeah you’re right.  We should give up. Good call. Why even have a football program? 

Solid point. Good post.

Never said or implied that. I’m not taking a job where there is a volatile environment. Neither would the cream of the crop. Again, I was not being critical or combative - just looking at it as a job. 
sorry to have interrupted the rants. I’ll just continue to lurk.

[nixtosanders94 2,180]

Just now, kwagoner said:

Never said or implied that. I’m not taking a job where there is a volatile environment. Neither would the cream of the crop. Again, I was not being critical or combative - just looking at it as a job. 
sorry to have interrupted the rants. I’ll just continue to lurk.

How dare you interrupt my rants! I can’t belie....nah man its all good. Sorry I came off harsh there. You’re right about the drama but its not changing anytime soon Im afraid.

[bigbird 60,939]

2 hours ago, AUFriction said:

Take a look at the best coaches in our history. Most of them have averaged between 65 and 70 percent wins. 8/12 is 66.6%. 9/12 is 75%. Most coaches that have done “well” here have won the equivalent (accounting for changes in the number of games) of 8-9 games a season. That’s not opinion. It’s statitsics. 

Why should we settle for historical marks? Why can't we aim for better? 

[aubearcat 2,163]

1 minute ago, bigbird said:

Why should we settle for historical marks? Why can't we aim for better? 

Indeed 

[bigbird 60,939]

3 minutes ago, aubearcat said:

Indeed 

Driving a model T is an option but I sure like the F-150

[JDUBB4AU 5,287]

3 hours ago, bigbird said:

In a 12 game season, 8 should never be expected. 

This . To expect mediocrity is bull . To say AU will always be a contender every 4 years , but suck the others is crap. Things can change . Look at Clemson . Similar to AU in every way. AU can be the next Clemson , bama , or Ohio state . They need the right leadership. From HC to the BOT. Leadership at every level determines the product on the field . I don’t give a damn about the past . Saying AU can’t be better due to its history ?? I can’t except that.. 

[Farmer Brown 2,461]

All the "if" scenarios aren't going to happen. Alabama and Georgia will beat us. Our defense will keep it close, until the three and outs, wears them out. Then, Gusto will blame the loss on lack of execution, on high percentage plays. We see what we could have with the right offense. His takeover of the offense, hasn't caused anything but a regression. At least he didn't throw away the Oregon game, and we didn't play 6 qb's in the opener.

[Old fan 47 799]

3 hours ago, nixtosanders94 said:

Oh my god Im sick of having to answer this stupid argument...for the 99th freaking time...no one on here said a damn thing about going unbeaten every year or doing what bama has done. Just play a decent god forsaken offense and don’t look like dog poo in big games. That’s literally all we’re saying. With a halfway decent, competent offense we are 9-0 right now. Go back and read birds post where with a halfway competent offense we are about 40-4 in our last 44. But no one, like literally zero people I know have said they expect perfection every year. Good grief.

Good post. Gus is nowhere near an offensive guru. All teams with partial talent on defense are not fooled by his pee wee brand of football. As fans, we all have the right to our opinion and the bottom line is this: 1) we are going to be in big trouble on both sides of the lines next year 2) our recruiting has been creeping outside of the top 10 in the last few years and 3) I for one do not expect to compete for a national title every year, but averaging 8 wins is well below what AU athletes and fans should expect. Many of us on here could argue these points all day, but the bottom line which is the record and the way our offenses have looked the last 4 years is just not getting it done. Don’t get me wrong, I do not put all blame on Gus, because he didn’t miss three field goals last night, but play calling and execution definitely contributes to a field goal being 45 or 35. 

[AU-24 3,130]

2 hours ago, fredst said:

I see what you’re saying but I hope and want for better. With the “Auburn culture” I want to see us make the leap that Clemson has. I think we can with the right guy at the helm. I’m not entirely sure who that guy is but I don’t think it’s our current guy. I don’t think many would have predicted that Dabo would be that guy for them so it will require somebody (ie AG)doing some thoughtful searching and the Prez/BOT letting the process work like it is supposed to. It is a risk but what in life that’s worthwhile doesn’t have risk?

Good points.

Example: I think when we went and got Bruce Pearl, we knew exactly what we were getting. One of the best coaches in the country that might (might) flirt with trouble.

I just think a Bob Stoops or Hugh Freeze hire is minimum risk, possibly maximum gain.

 

[Farmer Brown 2,461]

Hugh Freeze. He would cause a lot of friction with other fan bases, but they hate us already. They would make fun of us, but probably no more than they already do with Gustus.

[Mims44 2,000]

42 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Why should we settle for historical marks? Why can't we aim for better? 

I believe that is 100% of posters on the forum, everyone wants a repeat of 2010.Some are just a bit more... irate than others.

30 minutes ago, JDUBB4AU said:

This . To expect mediocrity is bull . To say AU will always be a contender every 4 years , but suck the others is crap. Things can change . Look at Clemson . Similar to AU in every way. AU can be the next Clemson , bama , or Ohio state . They need the right leadership. From HC to the BOT. Leadership at every level determines the product on the field . I don’t give a damn about the past . Saying AU can’t be better due to its history ?? I can’t except that.. 

I must have missed that post, when has anyone ever said on these forums that Auburn CAN'T be better?

 

[AUApostle 7,758]

Gus supporters = Lebo and Barbee supporters...”you can’t win big at Auburn there are too many obstacles to overcome”.

[AU-24 3,130]

Coach Willie is now available. 

[doug3020 842]

3 minutes ago, AU-24 said:

Coach Willie is now available. 

Holy crap they weren't messing around. Granted, he fielded an awful team. Undisciplined is the word that comes to mind.

[IronMan70 3,321]

What are these high standards some people are talking about ? Is winning at least 9 games every year, achieved by not losing games we have no business losing, a high standard ? That seems pretty reasonable to me and should be a minimum standard. This is a team that was better overall than every team we played so far, including Fla and LSU. We have the defense, we have the recruiting and we have the players. If not for continuing to lose games we should never have lost, 9-0 would have been very attainable. 

[AUFriction 1,179]

1 hour ago, bigbird said:

Why should we settle for historical marks? Why can't we aim for better? 

There’s nothing wrong with aiming high. But to expect better than our history in the best division in the best conference in college football is just insane.

Only one coach has achieved anything close to that level of success against that level of competition, and it’s Saban. There just aren’t that many elite coaches in existence. Even if Gus is shown the door, it’s statistically more likely that we’d hire someone less good than Gus than someone better.

Even if such a coach were to come available, the most elite of coaches wouldn’t take this job right now. First, this is quite frankly the hardest job in football right now. Our biggest rivals  have been top 10 teams for most of the last decade, and LSU has been more up than down. Now we also have to play A&M who isn’t the hardest of teams typically, but is no pushover. Because we are rivals of these programs, we have fierce competition for recruiting that other programs outside the SECW don’t have. Finally, the perceptions of Auburn’s program outside the southeast is that our fans and administration are finicky. A lot of it was media spun up nonsense. However, jetgate started some of this, and how Gus is being viewed by our fan base right now has perpetuated it.

The coach it would take to get to 11 win seasons every year would never come here, and that’s assuming an available one exists. 

[bigbird 60,939]

6 minutes ago, AUFriction said:

There’s nothing wrong with aiming high. But to expect better than our history in the best division in the best conference in college football is just insane.

Only one coach has achieved anything close to that level of success against that level of competition, and it’s Saban. There just aren’t that many elite coaches in existence. Even if Gus is shown the door, it’s statistically more likely that we’d hire someone less good than Gus than someone better.

Even if such a coach were to come available, the most elite of coaches wouldn’t take this job right now. First, this is quite frankly the hardest job in football right now. Our biggest rivals  have been top 10 teams for most of the last decade, and LSU has been more up than down. Now we also have to play A&M who isn’t the hardest of teams typically, but is no pushover. Because we are rivals of these programs, we have fierce competition for recruiting that other programs outside the SECW don’t have. Finally, the perceptions of Auburn’s program outside the southeast is that our fans and administration are finicky. A lot of it was media spun up nonsense. However, jetgate started some of this, and how Gus is being viewed by our fan base right now has perpetuated it.

The coach it would take to get to 11 win seasons every year would never come here, and that’s assuming an available one exists. 

8 wins out if 12 is 66%

9 wins out if 12 is 75%

Why expect and settle for a failing grade. 9 should be the minimum. With our talent, recruiting footprint, and resources, We should beat everyone on our schedule except LSU, Bama, and UGA and those should be 50/50 games. That is what the expectations should be.

[DAG 34,751]

The problem is the best coaches in our history have been average coaches at best. I am not speaking of dye since he was before my time . However, tubs isn’t some hot commodity , nor was gene (won a freaking NC) and neither is Gus. Man, it would be nice to find a proven coach for once. But what I will say is even if we don’t have a proven coach, I do hope we get away from “auburn men” and find coaches who have shown they have been able to win from nothing, consistently.

[fredst 9,070]

22 minutes ago, bigbird said:

8 wins out if 12 is 66%

9 wins out if 12 is 75%

Why expect and settle for a failing grade. 9 should be the minimum. With our talent, recruiting footprint, and resources, We should beat everyone on our schedule except LSU, Bama, and UGA and those should be 50/50 games. That is what the expectations should be.

This. Resigning AU to mediocrity is such a defeatist attitude. If you accept mediocrity as your ceiling that is exactly what you’ll get. Holding on to Gus because “look, we could become UT” is a loser mindset.

[fredst 9,070]

And, to use the Clemson example again.... before 2010 their historical winning percentage was about 60% (and even with their incredible run they are still behind us all time). They found the right guy- maybe got lucky doing so- and are now on top of the mountain, considered one of the best programs in the nation. We may not get as lucky as them but we should aspire for nothing less.

[AUFriction 1,179]

53 minutes ago, bigbird said:

8 wins out if 12 is 66%

9 wins out if 12 is 75%

Why expect and settle for a failing grade. 9 should be the minimum. With our talent, recruiting footprint, and resources, We should beat everyone on our schedule except LSU, Bama, and UGA and those should be 50/50 games. That is what the expectations should be.

The passing grade we’ve adopted in this country is arbitrary, based largely on educational studies decades and decades ago. A 70 is not the end all be all pass fail cutoff for everything. In a lot of circumstances, it makes no psychometric sense to use such a normative cutoff.

This is particularly true with relative as opposed to absolute performance metrics. What is considered passing is based on a standardized distribution, not a percentage in a vacuum. To do so violates the statistical assumption of observation independence. Our success has to be compared to other programs in the power 5 and in the SEC. If you do that, we aren’t doing that bad.

[Eagle-1 3,821]

2 hours ago, AU-24 said:

Good points.

Example: I think when we went and got Bruce Pearl, we knew exactly what we were getting. One of the best coaches in the country that might (might) flirt with trouble.

I just think a Bob Stoops or Hugh Freeze hire is minimum risk, possibly maximum gain.

 

I'm all in on Freeze. I just don't see Auburn making that move frankly. 

With The talent we currently have Freeze would put the fear of God in defensive coordinators in the SEC. 

We would also more than likely stop losing elite skill position players in the state of Alabama to the likes of GA, and Clemson.