homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 Just now, SaltyTiger said: I would say yes seems to a bit of optimism in the air now. I noticed that it started around Nov. 9, 2016. Sure you were to busy searching Vox and HuffPO for Russia Collusion articles. Foolish answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,559 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, homersapien said: Foolish answer. Why Brother Homer? You asked a question and I answered. Yes is simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 Just now, SaltyTiger said: Why Brother Homer? You asked a question and I answered. Yes is simple. Your response reflects ignorance of the dynamics between the POTUS and policy changes on the economy and a total disregard for the long term leadership ability the POTUS is obligated to provide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,559 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, homersapien said: Your response reflects ignorance of the dynamics between the POTUS and policy changes on the economy and a total disregard for the long term leadership ability the POTUS is obligated to provide. Settle down, go outside and enjoy this gorgeous cool air tonight, and look on the upside Brother Homer. We survived Barry for 8 long years of pessimism....all is great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,116 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 58 minutes ago, homersapien said: Foolish answer. Befits the question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NolaAuTiger 3,295 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 11 hours ago, homersapien said: Foolish answer. You’re getting schooled, son Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proud Tiger 4,261 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 11 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: I would say yes seems to a bit of optimism in the air now. I noticed that it started around Nov. 9, 2016. Sure you were to busy searching Vox and HuffPO for Russia Collusion articles. I say yes too. He can lie up a storm as long as I'm making a lot of money in the stock market, keeps on making his accomplishments, and makes America a strong and respected country again. Also let someone who doesn't lie sometime throw the first rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,116 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 19 hours ago, HVAU said: Everytime this is a conservative's attitude this is the chart that comes to mind, and I still use it every single time. Under Obama the unemployment rate moved from ~10% to ~4.3%, yet not once have I heard a republican praise the fiscal success of the Obama administration. Under Trump the unemployment rate has moved from ~4.3% to ~3.9%, and you guys act like the spirit of John Galt himself has jumped from Ayn Rand's butthole and possessed the current president, bestowing him with omnipotent financial grace. I'm very happy that more people in this country have employment than they did after the last time the GOP tanked the economy (I know it's more complex than that). Hopefully, that ballooning budget deficit doesn't become a problem. I would refer you to the Boston Feds analysis of the decline Labor Participation rates that accompany the decline in unemployment you show above...1/4 of the impact was attributed to changing demographics (on the low they estimated 0.3% and most likely 0.6%)...3/4's of the reduction due to a reduction in demand for labor beyond what would be expected in a post recession environment (the expected V curve)....no job growth; no jobs...until recently that is. It's a laborious read; I had the good fortune to have it explained to me.... As to who caused "the great recession"; that is pretty clearly the economic policies that Trump was elected to reverse bestowed on us by both parties over nearly 4 decades of "free love economics". Happy to engage in a serious discussion of the failures of both Republican and Democrat policies that caused the issues. I have had to live, invest and manage thru our policies in Europe, Asia, Latam and the US over these 3 decades. None of those policies favored investing in the US. We've committed the policy equivalent of ritual economic suicide for over 30 years. Per the Washington Post, the Washington DC areas has become one of the wealthiest places in the free world (9 of the 20 wealthiest counties in America (thus the world) are around DC); so much wealth accumulated by "public servants" is a bit hard to understand; and Washington promoted policies to build the middle class - well, the Chinese and Indian middle class - that is. We need to continue to unravel the nightmare that is DC, unravel the economic regime that says foreign workers have a right to lower cost US investment/capital $$ than the American worker that creates them; and provide for tax, incentive structures and industrial policy that builds American wealth and American jobs....1st...everytime. When I go to China and India, I see the optimism that I saw growing up in the US in the 60's and 70's....the American spirit that said "we can do anything"...in China and India. For over a decade, we've seen American's say our best days are behind us....and we've had leaders that told us we had to expect less and that it is time for other nations to drive the future "american" dream....that is a goddam tragedy. That is a failure of leadership...that is a failure of parents...that is a failure of faith in our institutions and the people running them...that is a failure of those institutions and ultimately that is a failure of intellect and imagination. We are finally seeing again, after over a decade, more Americans think our best days are ahead of us and half of Americans are optimistic about the economy... in one year; this has been turned around...and for the 1st time in my business career; I am able to make decisions about bringing jobs back to America; because the disparity in tax rates has been removed...now, all I have to do is look at the productivity of the American worker vs the world...guess what, the American worker wins in that head to head battle. I could give exactly the same ***** about who Trump screws or what he said to whom as I gave about where Bill Clinton put his cigars (i.e., no *****) .... what I liked about Clinton was at least he got things done....didn't always agree with what he did (such as NAFTA); but at least he got something done, more right than wrong I feel; and I fundamentally felt he loved America....and understood America....it's good to see someone that unashamedly loves America again, putting American's 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 11 hours ago, japantiger said: Befits the question You don't think Trump habitually lies? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 11 hours ago, SaltyTiger said: Settle down, go outside and enjoy this gorgeous cool air tonight, and look on the upside Brother Homer. We survived Barry for 8 long years of pessimism....all is great You asked, I responded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 54 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said: You’re getting schooled, son You're an arrogant little jerk, boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 10 hours ago, japantiger said: I would refer you to the Boston Feds analysis of the decline Labor Participation rates that accompany the decline in unemployment you show above...1/4 of the impact was attributed to changing demographics (on the low they estimated 0.3% and most likely 0.6%)...3/4's of the reduction due to a reduction in demand for labor beyond what would be expected in a post recession environment (the expected V curve)....no job growth; no jobs...until recently that is. It's a laborious read; I had the good fortune to have it explained to me.... Good point. It illustrates my comment to Salty about the indirect - if best - effect any given POTUS has on the economy. Trump was fortunate enough to come into office while the economy was trending positive. (I thought he might mess it up by imposing tariffs, but so far so good). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 10 hours ago, japantiger said: As to who caused "the great recession"; that is pretty clearly the economic policies that Trump was elected to reverse bestowed on us by both parties over nearly 4 decades of "free love economics". Happy to engage in a serious discussion of the failures of both Republican and Democrat policies that caused the issues. The great recession was caused directly by the deregulation policies pursued by both Clinton and Bush. This allowed the banks to essentially profit from fraud and the American people were happy to participate because they were getting rich as well - until the whole thing collapsed. Trump is in no way trying to reverse such deregulation policies - just the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,116 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 38 minutes ago, homersapien said: The great recession was caused directly by the deregulation policies pursued by both Clinton and Bush. This allowed the banks to essentially profit from fraud and the American people were happy to participate because they were getting rich as well - until the whole thing collapsed. Trump in no way is trying to reverse such deregulation policies - just the opposite. He's only been president a 1.5 years.....can't do everything day one...can't do anything if the economy isn't growing, producing jobs and creating wealth. One step at a time...got 6.5 more years to undo every other bad decision of 40 years of administrations... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,116 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 49 minutes ago, homersapien said: You don't think Trump habitually lies? Really? I think he lies just like every other politician....you just don't like his lies while you couldn't get enough of Obama's (and Hillary's) lies...the difference here to, is Trump's lies don't cost me, the US economy and our global security .... Obama's lies cost me money, ****** up my health insurance, put the nation in a Jimmy Carter like malaise and set the middle east on fire....Trump's lies? so far, I've got more money in my pocket, the economy is good, people are more optimistic, China is at the table on trade and peace is breaking out all over (North Korea wants to end the war, the Saudi's are liberalising and supporting Israel, ISIS is gone, Egypt has stabilized, and we killed a s*** load of Russians in Syria when they tried to pull some nonsense).... I feel like the woman setting on Pinocchio's face..."lie to me baby, lie to me"..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HVAU 673 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 2 hours ago, japantiger said: reduction due to a reduction in demand for labor beyond what would be expected in a post recession environment (the expected V curve)....no job growth; no jobs...until recently that is. It's a laborious read; I had the good fortune to have it explained to me.... Please provide me with a link to this study. I'm interested to see how it concludes that there was virtually no job growth, conflicting with the Bureau of Labor Statistics, during Obama's era, yet magically those low unemployment numbers are correct once Trump is in office...for a year and a few months. I'm about to take my kid to a birthday party. After that I'll take a look and respond to your other points. There is a lot to discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 1 hour ago, japantiger said: He's only been president a 1.5 years.....can't do everything day one...can't do anything if the economy isn't growing, producing jobs and creating wealth. One step at a time...got 6.5 more years to undo every other bad decision of 40 years of administrations... Hmmm, I am getting mixed messages here. You give Trump credit for 18 months of what is - obviously - a continuing economic trend that started way before his election. He's done nothing except plant the seeds for future economic problems while rewarding the same folks that brought us the financial collapse. And seriously, he won't serve a second term. I still believe he won't survive one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 5, 2018 Author Share Posted May 5, 2018 1 hour ago, japantiger said: I think he lies just like every other politician....you just don't like his lies while you couldn't get enough of Obama's (and Hillary's) lies...the difference here to, is Trump's lies don't cost me, the US economy and our global security .... Obama's lies cost me money, ****** up my health insurance, put the nation in a Jimmy Carter like malaise and set the middle east on fire....Trump's lies? so far, I've got more money in my pocket, the economy is good, people are more optimistic, China is at the table on trade and peace is breaking out all over (North Korea wants to end the war, the Saudi's are liberalising and supporting Israel, ISIS is gone, Egypt has stabilized, and we killed a s*** load of Russians in Syria when they tried to pull some nonsense).... I feel like the woman setting on Pinocchio's face..."lie to me baby, lie to me"..... All politicians lie, but Trump is clearly in a class of his own. One cannot believe anything he says. Obama didn't put the country in an economic malaise, just the opposite. He inherited a disaster and it improved steadily over time. His biggest mistake was not indicting those directly responsible for the disaster and hold them accountable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HVAU 673 Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 5 hours ago, japantiger said: As to who caused "the great recession"; that is pretty clearly the economic policies that Trump was elected to reverse bestowed on us by both parties over nearly 4 decades of "free love economics". Happy to engage in a serious discussion of the failures of both Republican and Democrat policies that caused the issues. I have had to live, invest and manage thru our policies in Europe, Asia, Latam and the US over these 3 decades. None of those policies favored investing in the US.We've committed the policy equivalent of ritual economic suicide for over 30 years. Per the Washington Post, the Washington DC areas has become one of the wealthiest places in the free world (9 of the 20 wealthiest counties in America (thus the world) are around DC); so much wealth accumulated by "public servants" is a bit hard to understand; and Washington promoted policies to build the middle class - well, the Chinese and Indian middle class - that is. I can appreciate the anecdotal evidence that your investing experience has provided. However, you need to be specific about the policies you're referring to. Otherwise, you are simply, like our current president, throwing around generalities without actually engaging in policy discussion. 5 hours ago, japantiger said: We need to continue to unravel the nightmare that is DC, unravel the economic regime that says foreign workers have a right to lower cost US investment/capital $$ than the American worker that creates them; and provide for tax, incentive structures and industrial policy that builds American wealth and American jobs....1st...everytime. When I go to China and India, I see the optimism that I saw growing up in the US in the 60's and 70's....the American spirit that said "we can do anything"...in China and India. For over a decade, we've seen American's say our best days are behind us....and we've had leaders that told us we had to expect less and that it is time for other nations to drive the future "american" dream....that is a goddam tragedy. The problem here is that we've reached a point in the US where bringing back manufacturing engineer en masse is not only difficult, but potentially impossible. To do so would require either depressing wages of workers in order to compete with overseas competition, or increasing the cost of goods also known as inflation. Trump's strategies to achieve global trade "fairness" are naive and ad hoc. They may achieve some success in n the short term, but will most likely result in problems in the mid- to long-term (I'm speaking specifically here if his tariffs). Long-term success depends on incrementally leveling the playing field. The hamhand, Trump strategy may end with China dominating us. 5 hours ago, japantiger said: That is a failure of leadership...that is a failure of parents...that is a failure of faith in our institutions and the people running them...that is a failure of those institutions and ultimately that is a failure of intellect and imagination. We are finally seeing again, after over a decade, more Americans think our best days are ahead of us and half of Americans are optimistic about the economy... in one year; this has been turned around...and for the 1st time in my business career; I am able to make decisions about bringing jobs back to America; because the disparity in tax rates has been removed...now, all I have to do is look at the productivity of the American worker vs the world...guess what, the American worker wins in that head to head battle. Many of us began seeing this "better days ahead" situation halfway through the Obama era. I contend, still, that those that didn't were blinded by their adherence to the vitriol, spread by the right, against Obama. 5 hours ago, japantiger said: I could give exactly the same ***** about who Trump screws or what he said to whom as I gave about where Bill Clinton put his cigars (i.e., no *****) .... what I liked about Clinton was at least he got things done....didn't always agree with what he did (such as NAFTA); but at least he got something done, more right than wrong I feel; and I fundamentally felt he loved America....and understood America....it's good to see someone that unashamedly loves America again, putting American's 1st. I agree with you here, as I don't really care that Trump is an adulterer. I do care about the pattern of lying that is endemic to this administration. From Flynn to Sessions regarding Kislyak contacts, to Kushner's multiple security clearance revisionism, to Junior et al's frequent recategorization of the Trump Tower meeting, Trump's need to inflate any event he is associated with, his lies about statements he's made which are absolutely verifiable, his guarantees to lawmakers which, the guarantees, have proven to be worthless, etc., etc., etc. Trump will have his successes. He's been given a mechanism that received effective adjustments. Your implication that Obama, or even Bush, don't love America is garbage. It is, in my opinion, especially disgusting when your model of America love is quite possibly one if the luckiest conmen in US history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,559 Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 10 hours ago, homersapien said: Good point. It illustrates my comment to Salty about the indirect - if best - effect any given POTUS has on the economy. Trump was fortunate enough to come into office while the economy was trending positive. (I thought he might mess it up by imposing tariffs, but so far so good). Brother Homer, I am saying President Trumps election made a difference in the attitude of many people regarding our economic future. Open your eyes and see what started happening in the construction industry alone post election and pre inauguration. Trump was not "fortunate" to " come into office" he was duly elected by the electoral majority and dumped gas on smoldering stagnant economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 6, 2018 Author Share Posted May 6, 2018 42 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said: Brother Homer, I am saying President Trumps election made a difference in the attitude of many people regarding our economic future. Open your eyes and see what started happening in the construction industry alone post election and pre inauguration. Trump was not "fortunate" to " come into office" he was duly elected by the electoral majority and dumped gas on smoldering stagnant economy. My experience tells me that pooring gas on anything "smoldering" is a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltyTiger 8,559 Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 1 minute ago, homersapien said: My experience tells me that pooring gas on anything "smoldering" is a bad idea. Get it Brother Homer........you make a pretty good point at times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NolaAuTiger 3,295 Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 10 hours ago, homersapien said: Hmmm, I am getting mixed messages here. You give Trump credit for 18 months of what is - obviously - a continuing economic trend that started way before his election. He's done nothing except plant the seeds for future economic problems while rewarding the same folks that brought us the financial collapse. And seriously, he won't serve a second term. I still believe he won't survive one. Hahah!!! Poor baby. Glad to know that you wake up everyday with Donald Trump being your President. Also gives me a yuuggeee morale boost to know that my young skills have surpassed your seasoned ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homersapien 12,210 Posted May 6, 2018 Author Share Posted May 6, 2018 I am truly glad that a medium such as this didn't exist when I was so young and foolish. It would be embarrasing to go back and read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japantiger 4,116 Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 3 hours ago, homersapien said: I am truly glad that a medium such as this didn't exist when I was so young and foolish. It would be embarrasing to go back and read it. The good news is you don't have to imagine what you would have posted....you still post like a drug addled adolescent.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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