Birth Control Question

[MDM4AU 337]

Still, no one can answer my question on why BC is more essential than anything else and therefore FREE. I am open if someone can help me understand.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

channoc......But the real point kassc22 makes is that no BC should be free. I agree unless a whole lot of other things I can think of is free too.

And apparently her OBGYN agrees with her premise re. IUDs

[MDM4AU 337]

HL had every right to add copper IUD's they are listed as having the same effect as Plan B. http://www.hhs.gov/o...-contraception/

"The Copper T IUD is also very effective in preventing pregnancy. If put into place within five days after having sex, only one women out of 100 using the Copper T IUD will become pregnant"

That fits completely with their view that it is an abortifacient. To HL it is apparent they believe life begins when an egg is fertilized. That is perfectly within their rights.

Except science doesn't support that theory, nor do OBGYNs.

Not all OBGYN's...

[Weegle777 78]

HL had every right to add copper IUD's they are listed as having the same effect as Plan B. http://www.hhs.gov/o...-contraception/

"The Copper T IUD is also very effective in preventing pregnancy. If put into place within five days after having sex, only one women out of 100 using the Copper T IUD will become pregnant"

That fits completely with their view that it is an abortifacient. To HL it is apparent they believe life begins when an egg is fertilized. That is perfectly within their rights.

Except science doesn't support that theory, nor do OBGYNs.

Knew that was coming. Good grief.

[Kassc22 0]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women too stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Great post Kassc.

[channonc 466]

HL had every right to add copper IUD's they are listed as having the same effect as Plan B. http://www.hhs.gov/o...-contraception/

"The Copper T IUD is also very effective in preventing pregnancy. If put into place within five days after having sex, only one women out of 100 using the Copper T IUD will become pregnant"

That fits completely with their view that it is an abortifacient. To HL it is apparent they believe life begins when an egg is fertilized. That is perfectly within their rights.

Except science doesn't support that theory, nor do OBGYNs.

Not all OBGYN's...

http://m.acog.org/About_ACOG/News_Room/News_Releases/2011/IUDs_Implants_Are_Most_Effective_Reversible_Contraceptives_Available?IsMobileSet=true

[channonc 466]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

[Kassc22 0]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

I just said health insurance is a contract. If you don't want to pay for any of those things look for a contract that excludes them. I'm sure you can find one that exists.If you have enough buying power you can probably negotiate a new one with an insurance company. It still doesn't justify paying 100 percent of the cost of BC at the behest of the Federal government. WHY is BC so important?

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

I just said health insurance is a contract. If you don't want to pay for any of those things look for a contract that excludes them. I'm sure you can find one that exists.If you have enough buying power you can probably negotiate a new one with an insurance company. It still doesn't justify paying 100 percent of the cost of BC at the behest of the Federal government. WHY is BC so important?

We all truly know the answer but may not want to admit it....BC is important in this bill because it is an exclusive women's issue....which fits into the narrative (during this time of the bill's writing) "The republicans have a war on women" (Which we know is untrue but like everything POLs need sound bites for mantras [both sides do this]). Thus knowing this war can be waged on two fronts...against those with Christian beliefs that contraceptives that induce abortion is akin to murder and against the republicans who opposed this bill. that is the simple true answer why the mandate was put in....Why not other drugs covered in insurance for free? Not a battle cry or way of pinning it on a political opponent. Notice how the word liberal has been corrupted over the years....back in the day before FDR it was for folks who wanted smaller government and more freedom from political tyranny....since then it has become a very negative thing thus during Dean's reign as the DNC they changed from being "Liberals" to "Progressive" Why? Who wants to oppose progress? All of this crap is a shell game to make certain people richer and a thumb on everyone else with control of the many in the hands of the few....pure and simple....you can argue that fact all you want but truly break it down and see how you could change it....power is corrupting....

[TexasTiger 14,070]

This issue is much bigger than birth control, folks.

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

With the latest SCOTUS decision, there are those in the country who have no idea what the ruling actually said and how it affects 98% of working women. The meme that rights have been taken away from women couldn't be a bigger and more pathetic lie. Overlooked is the fact that "free" birth control is still an essential benefit under this "affordable" care act.

Which leads to my question...why must it be free? What makes birth control so important that it should be free?

Free? Payed for with the help of insurance means free?

Also, I have a close personal friend that takes birth control for reasons other than contraception. Were she an employee of Hobby Lobby, her medical autonomy would have been violated. How is that not having rights taken away?

My sister was this way, she took it for reasons other than contraception starting at the age of 14 or 15.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Ben, I keep asking and you don't respond. Where does it say women have a right to BC?

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

I will be honest and say that I have zero issue with birth control being free at any level.

What makes it different than other stuff? It is the one thing that actually creates a life that will be dependent on others. The end result is a living, breathing being that is now here at no fault of its own. It has needs that are of no fault of its own.

Let's be honest also. Many males can not be expected to live up their to parts when it comes to birth control and children. You have a large number of males that will complain about, and not want to wear, and then find ways to slip condoms off during sex and then will orgasm inside the woman... knowing very well the consequences. Then will fight like hell to disclaim the child or to pay as little as they can in its direction. That is true from the poorest neighborhoods, to Auburns campus, to exclusive neighborhoods in Atlanta. I believe birth control should be a two person ordeal.

From a insurance side... I would say birth control would be cheaper.

From a societal side.... I would say birth control would be cheaper. Especially those that do not have the means of taking care of a child, because then that burden gets shifted onto others in the form of WIC and EBT and the various medical programs that are set up for children by the government. Most likely in this case the mother will be on medicaid herself also.

I will stay out of all the double standard, morale, or religious parts. The only part I will comment on is the abortion part and for that I will say I wish more would make the decision to take the child to tern and give it up for adoption as there are many couples that would make great parents that can not have children and would love the chance to raise one from the infant stages.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Tex4Auburn....why aren't condoms for men covered especially those coated with spermicide for BC?

[cptau 169]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

I just said health insurance is a contract. If you don't want to pay for any of those things look for a contract that excludes them. I'm sure you can find one that exists.If you have enough buying power you can probably negotiate a new one with an insurance company. It still doesn't justify paying 100 percent of the cost of BC at the behest of the Federal government. WHY is BC so important?

I think there are multiple reasons BC is so important and it depends on the group. Some women just see it as another job benefit. Some use the medications for related health problems. Others see it as a means to be sexually activity without the risk of pregnacy, makes them equal to men. Employers usually are willing to pay for it as it's cheaper than paying for births and maternity leaves. Other just like to use it as a political issue.

It is interesting that BC may be the only medical treatment whose primary function is to prevent a normal life function, reproduction. Medical treatments normally correct or treat something that has gone wrong. Even then health insurance will not pay to fix something's that are corrections, such as LASIK eye surgery.

[homersapien 12,172]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

I just said health insurance is a contract. If you don't want to pay for any of those things look for a contract that excludes them. I'm sure you can find one that exists.If you have enough buying power you can probably negotiate a new one with an insurance company. It still doesn't justify paying 100 percent of the cost of BC at the behest of the Federal government. WHY is BC so important?

I think there are multiple reasons BC is so important and it depends on the group. Some women just see it as another job benefit. Some use the medications for related health problems. Others see it as a means to be sexually activity without the risk of pregnacy, makes them equal to men. Employers usually are willing to pay for it as it's cheaper than paying for births and maternity leaves. Other just like to use it as a political issue.

It is interesting that BC may be the only medical treatment whose primary function is to prevent a normal life function, reproduction. Medical treatments normally correct or treat something that has gone wrong. Even then health insurance will not pay to fix something's that are corrections, such as LASIK eye surgery.

Interesting? I suppose. But certainly not surprising. There are WAY more things that can go wrong with a pregnancy compared with using contraception. In fact, the worse thing that can go wrong with a contraception is pregnancy.

Regardless, if you are an insurer, you would obviously promote contraception over pregnancy. Supplying it free-of-charge to any woman you cover is a no-brainer from a business standpoint.

[homersapien 12,172]

OBGYNs as a group do not agree. It is a personal opinion from one to the other. My stepsister has an IUD she was told by her dr that if she ever became pregnant while it was inserted she would have no choice but to have an abortion because the child could not survive the removal. Sounds pretty scary to me. I personally belive life begins at conception, but I also believe that a woman has a choice. The choice is how to comport themselves sexually. There is never a reason for an unwanted pregnancy. Yes, yes we will all hear "RAPE, INCEST, MOTHERS LIFE". How often is that REALLY a factor? You can A. not have sex, B. use bc, C. Use condoms, or D. Use both. If after all of that you still become pregnant then I think someone is trying to tell you something. However yes, my bottom line is BC should not be free. There is ABSOLUTELY no reason for that one thing to be enshrined in this law as free. Are women to stupid to pay for it? Can they not add up the amount of cash to give to the person at the register? I don't get it. I worked as a pharmacy technician for years and let me tell you of all the pharmacists I worked with I can count on 1 hand the number who even wanted to stock plan b, and that applies to the ones who didn't agree it was a an abortifacient. (There are way more drugs that drs can sneakily give to induce abortions and you would never know btw). When it went OTC most were concerned about the possibility of young girls not understanding how serious a med it actually was bleeding to death. Employer sponsored insurance has always been based on what your employer negotiates to pay for in their contract with the insurance company. Never before has this been called into question. Suddenly the gov decides that all BC must be paid for in full by every plan. What if they said every plan must pay for abortion on demand in full? There would be an outcry over that as well. I'm sorry but the notion that my employer absolutely MUST pay in full for my BC is ridiculous. What am I working for? Why not mandate they have to pay for a car or a house too?

Using your logic, why bother with health insurance at all. I mean, there are plenty of procedures I could argue aren't life threatening. Why should I be forced to pay for someone's gastric bypass? What about statins? I mean just eat less bad stuff, and work more.

I just said health insurance is a contract. If you don't want to pay for any of those things look for a contract that excludes them. I'm sure you can find one that exists.If you have enough buying power you can probably negotiate a new one with an insurance company. It still doesn't justify paying 100 percent of the cost of BC at the behest of the Federal government. WHY is BC so important?

I think there are multiple reasons BC is so important and it depends on the group..... Others see it as a means to be sexually activity without the risk of pregnacy, makes them equal to men....

You don't have a problem with that, do you?

[AUDub 11,784]

Ben, I keep asking and you don't respond. Where does it say women have a right to BC?

What do you mean "where?"

I personally believe ease of access to contraceptives can dramatically improve quality of life, particularly for the poor.

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

Tex4Auburn....why aren't condoms for men covered especially those coated with spermicide for BC?

My response would be cause men don't like to wear condoms so you would be wasting your money. Also according to the FDA failure of the pill for females is less than one percent. The high end shoots up to 14% with condoms. Significant change in efficiency.

Truthfully birth control actually is one of those things that for the most part has fallen on the woman historically, and the woman's body is the one that the birth occurs in. Men put it on them to be on birth control, or to know their cycle, or even to be the ones carrying the condoms these days. With the exception of condoms and a vasectomy the most forms of birth control are designed for women.

There is work for a birth control pill for men. It will be interesting to see what happens if that makes the market, its still being tested. I would be for the coverage of the pill for men as I believe it would have high usage.

[homersapien 12,172]

Here's what Rush thinks:

......women treat pregnancy "like a disease" even though it is the consequence of their actions. "And yet, they wouldn't have the problem if they didn't do a certain thing," he said. "It's that simple."

He's right. That is pretty simple.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

Tex4Auburn.....I see where you are coming from but just disagree a bit. All men don't have a problem with condoms so they should be offered to men free if women are going to get theirs free. JHMO but It's a nit.

[Texan4Auburn 1,626]

Tex4Auburn.....I see where you are coming from but just disagree a bit. All men don't have a problem with condoms so they should be offered to men free if women are going to get theirs free. JHMO but It's a nit.

Your right, you can't play absolutes of course. I have no issues with them and the last woman I was intimate with would put them on and was sexy and playful when doing it. I just mention that cause ruining the moment or loss of erection while applying one is a major complaint males have.

But you can't deny that historically birth control has fallen primarily as the female responsibility, and of course I will point to the significant difference in effectiveness. Like I said, they come out with the equivalent for men then I believe that should be covered also. Cause males would have the same responsibility.. just take a pill a day.

[autigeremt 7,133]

This issue is much bigger than birth control, folks.

Just as the mandate represents.

[autigeremt 7,133]

The left yells for more government intervention. The right yells for more protectionism. The constitution says too much is too much. We are nearing the crossroads and a test to the laws that founded us. Simple as that.