Opinions? Do we really want people to vote that are.....

[Auctoritas 2,894]

I have no problem with requiring people to prove they are who they are. However, Voter ID law changes are not about free and fair elections, they're about disenfranchisement and trying to stay in power. Weegs, you mentioned sacrifices - count your blessings that you are in a position to make those sacrifices and not have to reap the consequences that someone less well off than you would have to.

The fact that the OP writes "too lazy or too stupid to get a FREEEEEE picture ID?" illustrates the issue more than I possibly ever could. Should they be allowed to vote? yes. They're American citizens. If you would like to deny a US citizen the right to vote, I sure wish you'd make a good case as to why the 15th Amendment shouldn't apply anymore.

Well off? You think I am well off?

If you think that you are able to make that sacrifice, then you are more well off than they are. If, to you, having an ID is a given, then you obviously do not have either an experience of, or an open mind to, another possibility.

I've worked with (or on) plenty of people in my life who legitimately do not have the resources or ability to take off a day of work to go to the DMV, or have transportation to get there and back. These people were, generally, elderly, African American, and quite poor. Many did not have a vehicle, which (if you really thought through it) they couldn't drive anyway. Because they don't have an ID.

If that's the case, then these people can't vote anyway, correct? Who takes them to vote?

I can't speak for that with examples, but I will say that in many counties (at least in GA, it's the only state I have experience with) the polling places are A) a lot closer to homes and generally have a shorter wait time. Part of borrowing transportation for the DMV is that you could be waiting several hours. Also, polls close later than the DMV does.

Also, many churches and civic groups have "get out the vote" shuttles. It's not uncommon for a senior facility to contract a bus to take everyone to the polls at one time.

[Weegle777 78]

If they can make that sacrifice to rent buses for people to vote, then they can do the same to bus them all to the DMV. There are ways if people would just stop making excuses.

[Elephant Tipper 430]

I will reiterate my stance: I am all for making sure someone can prove they are who they are. I don't have a big problem with requiring a picture ID. My issue is that the stated issue of Voter Fraud is a smoke screen to hide a more nefarious movement. I'd be equally as pissed in examples of voter suppression engineered by Democrats.

Gerrymandering and voter suppression makes me physically nauseous, no matter what country it is or who is doing it.

Please elucidate on how requiring an i.d. to vote equates to gerrymandering and suppression ? I'm genuinely interested in your explanation.

[Auctoritas 2,894]

If they can make that sacrifice to rent buses for people to vote, then they can do the same to bus them all to the DMV. There are ways if people would just stop making excuses.

Really? can you imagine a bus with 60 people hopping off at the DMV? I can't imagine that would end well - heck, I'm not sure that some of those DMVs have the building capacity to handle that AND their normal load.

Those are two completely different things, and you know it.

[Auctoritas 2,894]

I will reiterate my stance: I am all for making sure someone can prove they are who they are. I don't have a big problem with requiring a picture ID. My issue is that the stated issue of Voter Fraud is a smoke screen to hide a more nefarious movement. I'd be equally as pissed in examples of voter suppression engineered by Democrats.

Gerrymandering and voter suppression makes me physically nauseous, no matter what country it is or who is doing it.

Please elucidate on how requiring an i.d. to vote equates to gerrymandering and suppression ? I'm genuinely interested in your explanation.

ID to vote is not gerrymandering, I was using it as a separate thought as related to organized attempts to affect voting patterns. Sorry for that confusion

I've explained how the ID requirement can affect the ability of people to vote. I don't necessarily have a problem with the requirement, but it's not as simple an issue as some here want to believe. Again, my complaint is when the requirement has an ulterior motive of trying to keep people who would vote democrat away from the polls, not with the requirement of having a picture ID itself.

[Weegle777 78]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

[TexasTiger 14,069]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

[Weegle777 78]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Did you ever answer that question earlier?

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Gotcha Weegs !

[Elephant Tipper 430]

I will reiterate my stance: I am all for making sure someone can prove they are who they are. I don't have a big problem with requiring a picture ID. My issue is that the stated issue of Voter Fraud is a smoke screen to hide a more nefarious movement. I'd be equally as pissed in examples of voter suppression engineered by Democrats.

Gerrymandering and voter suppression makes me physically nauseous, no matter what country it is or who is doing it.

Please elucidate on how requiring an i.d. to vote equates to gerrymandering and suppression ? I'm genuinely interested in your explanation.

ID to vote is not gerrymandering, I was using it as a separate thought as related to organized attempts to affect voting patterns. Sorry for that confusion

I've explained how the ID requirement can affect the ability of people to vote. I don't necessarily have a problem with the requirement, but it's not as simple an issue as some here want to believe. Again, my complaint is when the requirement has an ulterior motive of trying to keep people who would vote democrat away from the polls, not with the requirement of having a picture ID itself.

You keep asserting this "ulterior motive" issue. I've never heard of such. What is the "ulterior motive" and what evidence do you have of it ?

Still sincere.

[Weegle777 78]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Well they do make special concessions about everything else, why not this?

[Elephant Tipper 430]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Well they do make special concessions about everything else, why not this?

Oooohhhh. Good insight Weegs.

How about it TT ? Weegs makes a good point.

[TexasTiger 14,069]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Well they do make special concessions about everything else, why not this?

The states passing these laws are controlled by Republicans who want fewer, not more, voters.

[Weegle777 78]

And you know this as fact? Or did Bill Maher tell you this?

[TexasTiger 14,069]

And you know this as fact? Or did Bill Maher tell you this?

Any honest Republican political operative would tell you this.

[Weegle777 78]

Right.......

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

If so many people out there can't get to some place to get a photo ID, how do they get to where they need to go to sign up for food stamps and other entitlements?

[Weegle777 78]

Exactly.

[autigeremt 7,131]

We can't even create a website in 3 years to enroll people into healthcare.....why in Gods name do we need a voter ID? Elections will always have a sliver of fraud. Win the majority and it's moot.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

God doesn't need an ID. Everyone else voting should. If having an ID to vote is not needed why is one needed for anything? What is terribly more important than voting? Lots of people have died for the right to vote. We owe it to them to keep voting honest even if fraud is a small percent

[autigeremt 7,131]

Hint of sarcasm with that first sentence.

[TexasTiger 14,069]

Do you honestly believe that the DMV along with the state wouldn't make special concessions to make this happen? Ye of little faith.

All of sudden, Weegs has great confidence in government efficiency.

Well they do make special concessions about everything else, why not this?

Oooohhhh. Good insight Weegs.

How about it TT ? Weegs makes a good point.

No, he doesn't. We have 50 state governments with their own agendas.

[AUisAll 2]

I will reiterate my stance: I am all for making sure someone can prove they are who they are. I don't have a big problem with requiring a picture ID. My issue is that the stated issue of Voter Fraud is a smoke screen to hide a more nefarious movement. I'd be equally as pissed in examples of voter suppression engineered by Democrats.

Gerrymandering and voter suppression makes me physically nauseous, no matter what country it is or who is doing it.

Please elucidate on how requiring an i.d. to vote equates to gerrymandering and suppression ? I'm genuinely interested in your explanation.

ID to vote is not gerrymandering, I was using it as a separate thought as related to organized attempts to affect voting patterns. Sorry for that confusion

I've explained how the ID requirement can affect the ability of people to vote. I don't necessarily have a problem with the requirement, but it's not as simple an issue as some here want to believe. Again, my complaint is when the requirement has an ulterior motive of trying to keep people who would vote democrat away from the polls, not with the requirement of having a picture ID itself.

You keep asserting this "ulterior motive" issue. I've never heard of such. What is the "ulterior motive" and what evidence do you have of it ?

Still sincere.

The ulterior motive is the GOP doesn't want dead people voting or people voting multiple times and the Democrats do. They use the 'voter suppression' BS the same way they do the term 'racist'.

[Auctoritas 2,894]

I will reiterate my stance: I am all for making sure someone can prove they are who they are. I don't have a big problem with requiring a picture ID. My issue is that the stated issue of Voter Fraud is a smoke screen to hide a more nefarious movement. I'd be equally as pissed in examples of voter suppression engineered by Democrats.

Gerrymandering and voter suppression makes me physically nauseous, no matter what country it is or who is doing it.

Please elucidate on how requiring an i.d. to vote equates to gerrymandering and suppression ? I'm genuinely interested in your explanation.

ID to vote is not gerrymandering, I was using it as a separate thought as related to organized attempts to affect voting patterns. Sorry for that confusion

I've explained how the ID requirement can affect the ability of people to vote. I don't necessarily have a problem with the requirement, but it's not as simple an issue as some here want to believe. Again, my complaint is when the requirement has an ulterior motive of trying to keep people who would vote democrat away from the polls, not with the requirement of having a picture ID itself.

You keep asserting this "ulterior motive" issue. I've never heard of such. What is the "ulterior motive" and what evidence do you have of it ?

Still sincere.

Well, the first one that comes to mind is the 2012 Pennsylvania case where the state house Majority Leader said:

“We are focused on making sure that we meet our obligations that we’ve talked about for years,” said Turzai in a speech to committee members Saturday. He mentioned the law among a laundry list of accomplishments made by the GOP-run legislature.

“Pro-Second Amendment? The Castle Doctrine, it’s done. First pro-life legislation – abortion facility regulations – in 22 years, done.

Voter ID, which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done.”

-http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/accidental-candor-about-voter-id

http://thinkprogress...-election-laws/

https://www.aclu.org...ter-suppression

http://www.indyweek....ent?oid=2679615

http://abcnews.go.co...620189#3 (this one is fun - the GOP sent out fliers to democratic areas with the wrong date for the election)

http://abcnews.go.co...y?id=17620189#1

http://www.huffingto..._b_2079941.html

http://www.nationalm...ter-in-florida/

http://www.thedailyb...tic-voters.html

http://www.thedailyb...oter-fraud.html

http://thinkprogress...er-suppression/

http://www.rollingst...voting-20110830

http://www.msnbc.com...oting-sweeps-us

http://www.azcentral...?nclick_check=1

http://www.cbsnews.c...igned-into-law/

In addition, there have been several studies done that show these laws have a suppressive effect on minority voting.

http://papers.ssrn.c...ract_id=1084598

http://www.nationalm...e-black-people/

moritzlaw.osu.edu/blogs/tokaji/voter%20id%20and%20turnout%20study.pdf

[TheBlueVue 177]

Food for thought about photo IDs. I took a new job in October. I figured all I would need to prove my identity was a driver's license and a social security card. Nope. I had to have them both notarized and when asked why they weren't sufficient I was told its a new federal regulation. Ah, so the federal govt is going to make it THAT difficult to prove identity to go to work but is willing to let dead people, illegal aliens and imposters, who have already voted once, vote again, without any regulatory restriction because the're disenfranchised and don't have the wherewithal to go get a photo ID. Gotcha!

The idea that this is an effort to suppress the vote is ridiculous. It is troublesome that illegal aliens are getting all kinds of govt assistance ie welfare payments, food stamps, section 8 housing. These people are NOT American citizens and they are all likely to vote in a predictable fashion and democrats know that. THIS is a potential problem. They have NO RIGHT to participate in the electoral process because THEY ARE NOT AMERICAN CITIZENS.

I do not buy the idea that people are unable to get a photo ID. They can get them when their govt benefits are at stake. A photo ID should be a baseline requirement for participation in the benefits of citizenry. It is high time to stop making excuses for this kind of unwillingness to participate in good faith. Clearly there are exceptions but I do not think it's an unreasonable requirement at all.