AUwent

What was he thinking?

I do have a bad feeling that UCF repeats 2017 though. Probably not (they're projected to go to the Military Bowl last I checked) but man there seems to be excitement around that program right now.

I wish him 8-10 wins a year. Nothing more, nothing less.

5 hours ago, cole256 said:

Maybe this will help. You think by not playing the best players now mean that in the future the team will be better from that?

Okay, fine, we should play our best players. I’m just a bit frustrated that they so happen to be seniors. When you have a bunch of youngins that are your best players, you can tel that the future is bright. 2007 Florida is my all time favorite game in part because it was won with a very young team. How many key contributors that night went on to help win us the BCSNC?

From what I can tell, we were pretty young in 1981 as well. Obviously we improved pretty darn quickly after that. Being in a situation where you’re rebuilding but all your players are seniors shows that the rebuild will last a while.

I’m going to be honest, everyone’s talking about how bad the schedule is—have these people been cryogenically frozen the last decade? This is pretty much the schedule we’ve always played. 🤷‍♂️ 
 

(I hope TX and OK help to change that.)

***
 

Including bowl, our goals should be 8 wins this year, 7 wins next year, and 9 wins the year after that.

6 minutes ago, DAG said:

even if they are not the best player? Again, this is not the NFL. There is literally zero benefit to not playing the best and trying to win every game.

Maybe. What I'm dreading is the thought of it taking till year FIVE to reach even 9 wins--we seem to be in a spot where we're not going to be able to actually start "rebuilding" until next year. And if a top 20 class is all we can hope for this year, then that's how long it would take to get an elite recruiting class and THEN get them experience. I still think year three is when we should shoot for 9, with year five being 10, but maybe those are too unreasonable expectations? This is why I'm trying to figure out what people's expectations are long term, dadgumit! If we're in the process of a rebuild I would just like to set a year to look forward to!

1 minute ago, DAG said:

You think this is the NFL? We might as well what? Just because you have low expectations, we should play the young guys? Your message doesn't''t make sense. Play to win the game and put the best people out there regardless of classification.

We might as well give people experience so that we have more experienced players next year, if 6-7 wins is what we're expecting. Once again, I DO NOT THINK that doing worse means you will get better recruits! But I don't think winning 6-7 games is going to impress them anyway, unless we clearly play tough and disciplined like in '81.

9 minutes ago, fredst said:

Because he inherited a depleted roster but instilled discipline and toughness and had a competitive team that still lost more than it won. Competitors want to be put in position to win. The ‘83 team was robbed of the natty they deserved two years later because of that toughness and discipline, not because they were the most talented team in the country. That foundation was laid by his first team and recruiting thrived as a result

And if that's what lures the recruits in, then I'm good. There's just people making it sound like we have to do what CTB or CGM did to draw the recruits.

So, my signature stands.

@au302: Maybe I am wrong. My thinking was that it's a "we might as well" scenario. Our expectations for this year are pretty low even with all those seniors--a look at that depth chart and you'd think this would be a classic Auburn dark horse year. I WAS NOT saying that having a worse record will make the recruits come. What I'm saying is long as displaying a tough, disciplined brand of football gets them to come, if our win total prospects this year are muted, then I wasn't seeing much that could be sacrificed. We were a young team in years such as 1981 and 1999, and part of why we improved so much the next year was because we had so many returning starters.

2 minutes ago, au302 said:

Let’s just relax and let it play out. Anyone expecting Harsin to win 9+ with guys who don’t fit his system isn’t fair. There are bound to be struggles when transitioning to new systems. Part of football. I do believe we very well could win that many, but I’m not expecting it. In terms of recruiting, FSU was a complete joke last year and the last few years and is still attracting recruits. We need to start who gives us the best chance. If we suck come mid October, I’m fine with giving younger guys more snaps 

And if we can do that, then fine. But by year three we'd better start seeing some results.

7 minutes ago, fredst said:

So, Dye played less than the best to increase his odds in recruiting and it paid off because he signed Bo? Interesting take….

No. But the fact is he didn't do what CTB and CGM did in their first years and clearly recruits still took notice (Bo and Ben Tamburello, both of whom we beat out UAT for). CTT also lost six games in his first year and again, the recruits took notice (Jason Campbell was very highly touted IIRC). If Harsin can do the same, then ok, he can have a tough first two years and the recruits will still come. This is a different point than my argument about starters, BTW.

10 minutes ago, fredst said:

What do you think is the best plan then? Starting second string guys and hoping for the best? We are dealing with the effects of years of poor recruiting that will take years to sort out. To suggest that playing anything but the best is a good strategy because of the roster situation we are in is…..unusual. You are recommending “tanking”, from game one, to gain experience for the future?

If going 8-5 this year with competitive play all around can get us a top 20 class this year and a top 12 the year after that and consistency in the top 10 beyond, then I guess not. And while we're trying to sort out the effects of those years of poor recruiting, we might as well try to figure out when we should expect to start winning 9-10 games a year. I say 2023.

3 minutes ago, augolf1716 said:

Like what would you get out of it. No one knows what the hell is going to happen for sure in win and loses. Your reasoning is just crazy and really makes no sense no disrespect but damn. 

Fair enough. Let the games begin...

35 minutes ago, fredst said:

So….we should start underclassmen that aren’t really good enough to start because starting this many seniors torpedoes our chances for future recruiting success? This kind of forward thinking is so far ahead of the curve that it doesn’t even register on the current curve. Clearly, this is the kind of genius that will lead Napier to become a HOF coach….

 

 

Because if this year will be a struggle, like many seem to think it will be even if we do start all these seniors, I'd like to at least have the benefit of having at least half of them returning next year. I'd rather win 9 games and have that boost recruiting as well, but most do not think that's realistic. 1981 is the analogy I hear passed around so often for this year, so if that's the case then how can we rely on our record to have a good recruiting class? We went 5-6 that year and all we did the following February was sign that kid from Bessemer. Clearly CPD didn't need to rely on having a big first season then. Why should Harsin?

8 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

K. So basically no matter what we're doomed bc we didn't get the west coast Will Muschamp and a guy whom you don't know his name.

Oh I know his name. But to annoy people a bit less I didn't say it because I've made my want for him quite clear. As golf said, he's my "man crush" hahahaha.

6 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

So you're Cristobal stan and now just being unreasonable and assuming Harsin is gonna tank?

Cristobal or <the guy at Louisiana-Lafayette> was who I was rooting for.

My point is that I see two strains of thought among our fanbase this offseason:

1) We need to show results and therefore win games to attract good recruits.

2) It's going to be a couple of rebuilding years before we can hope for even 9 wins (Golf).

And if both are true, Harsin will "tank" and we better start praying for Dinky to ride off into the sunset by mid to late of the decade. Fortunately, it's highly possible that one isn't true!

5 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

If we have a good first season, getting players here in the protal and from HS will be easier. If we go 4-8 that would make it even harder.

Yeah. We are gonna lose a ton if Sr lineman, but pretend we go 9-3, get a couple kids drafted or atleast in the discussion, we can reload a good bit in the portal. 

I would be thrilled if your scenario happens. But we aren't supposed to go 9-3. So if we're assuming it's going to be a couple of rebuilding years like Golf and others say, how are we going to start attracting talent? Or are we just fated for 6-7 wins until Dinky hangs it up? The reason I wanted who I wanted was because I thought he was someone who could sell recruits without immediate success.

18 minutes ago, augolf1716 said:

Damn I bet you're a hoot at parties... its going to be a rough few years you can thank frickin Gus for that.............I mean what did you really really expect the next few years to be. 

Fine (this is why I'd like to see "timetables" of expectations for the next five years). 

So yeah, for CBH's first two years he gets a pass winning seven games and a bowl can be one of them, so long as we're competitive. But it is COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE if we're still having this convo in August 2023. This is also why we can't be relying on results this year to sell recruiting, as I see some arguing in the recruiting thread.

8 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Who cares what people think. You think the team would be cool with guys sitting because they are seniors and guys not as good playing? You think the team will play hard for that? And what about the juniors? What do they think are going to happen to them? What would any guy on the team think? Are you even thinking at all?

Fair. But in that case, we shouldn't be having this "I just want to be competitive" mentality. As you can tell by my sig my (counting bowl) requirements for '21 and '22 are 7 wins. But after looking at our depth chart, I'm not sure how we could expect to even be as good in '22 as '21. So what are we going to be saying next year? "I just hope we can win 5 games?"

3 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I don't think you realize what you are saying isn't making too much sense

HOW does it not make sense? Most people have low expectations for this year and are viewing it as a building year. So, if we don't expect to win 9 games (counting bowl) can we NOT be in a situation where the next year will be even tougher?

7 minutes ago, augolf1716 said:

Vegas has us at 6.5 to 7.5 wins I'd be happy with 8 especially with the schedule we have

 

I rest my case as to why I'm not pleased at the number of seniors we're starting. Before I read the depth chart I would've been quite happy with 7-5 and then a bowl win, with the losses being close (followed by a top 20 recruiting class).

7 hours ago, McLoofus said:

Imagine telling Shaun Shivers and Owen Pappoe that you're practicing for next year. 

The stuff people say is so wild. 

Nah Shivers and Pappoe are good to start. I’m talking more the OL.

But if we’re starting this many seniors, I’m starting to think 9-4 (counting bowl) shouldn’t be an unfair expectation.

17 minutes ago, cole256 said:

This is a new coach first year. You play your best players. Period

Ok, but this better not become a case where every year we’re saying “this is a rebuilding year, we’re young, I just hope we’re competitive, 7 wins, etc.” See Tenn over the last 15 years.

If we were expecting 9-10 wins this year I’d be okay with it. But most people are expecting a rebuilding year, no? It’s not good when you’re rebuilding but expect the next year to be even more of a rebuilding year. With another all new OL would Tank really want to play another year and risk hurting his NFL prospects? 

This is WAY too senior-heavy a lineup for what’s supposed to be a rebuilding year.  Very worried about 2022.

Painful beyond words to see how Frost has turned out. I was rooting for him so hard.